summaryrefslogtreecommitdiff
path: root/ad/d4b84f40f1f98d27133ce088c9438d68b28bb0
blob: 07e96768682f14faea5512de7bc4448b3952b608 (plain)
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
129
130
131
132
133
134
135
136
137
138
139
140
141
142
143
144
145
146
147
148
149
150
151
152
153
154
155
156
157
158
159
160
161
162
163
164
165
166
167
168
169
170
171
172
173
174
175
176
177
178
179
180
181
182
183
184
185
186
187
188
189
190
191
192
Return-Path: <elombrozo@gmail.com>
Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org
	[172.17.192.35])
	by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E0388273
	for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
	Sun, 28 Jun 2015 14:13:18 +0000 (UTC)
X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6
Received: from mail-pa0-f46.google.com (mail-pa0-f46.google.com
	[209.85.220.46])
	by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8B6107C
	for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
	Sun, 28 Jun 2015 14:13:18 +0000 (UTC)
Received: by pactm7 with SMTP id tm7so91529384pac.2
	for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
	Sun, 28 Jun 2015 07:13:18 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113;
	h=subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc
	:message-id:references:to;
	bh=hMmneY5DPpdtS70rm98ARWdA1AkjMhTqzgPLXkmgsAg=;
	b=HqSFmedkirOsxLp8RacLPsDMfxRhqjy8ms0XLD+TKc1+S6tnxsekbuIqKGMX6GUEMr
	4EqynC3o1X5A8GaznTRukzmkAOVHN5WbkobiPSjiVFMdKAcqGQiY8J6W02uP9EkIezDS
	HaUHgIofm4wG6pH8lf5aNtfyxvXfdSeqXET6rSPeR9xtmON3gCLJqHT/2sOPS64Du23i
	cS2a1p7nTwcjbLDNPLr+1tAm7MKkig/N+2zay9oHqHjmhOux4qmnv8TOteDCM6dVbXTt
	+dOn/ekUaKaneJAvADfq7TmIfF52PKkvZpXgr+/hsd3RLyXd324+VvNYp0zg6Jb0fU4p
	egOA==
X-Received: by 10.66.119.105 with SMTP id kt9mr22735033pab.86.1435500798309;
	Sun, 28 Jun 2015 07:13:18 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.1.102] (cpe-76-167-237-202.san.res.rr.com.
	[76.167.237.202]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id
	nl10sm39255528pdb.38.2015.06.28.07.13.15
	(version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128);
	Sun, 28 Jun 2015 07:13:16 -0700 (PDT)
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 8.2 \(2098\))
Content-Type: multipart/signed;
	boundary="Apple-Mail=_07E2AF13-0263-411C-AABC-31F7555FE88F";
	protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512
X-Pgp-Agent: GPGMail 2.5b6
From: Eric Lombrozo <elombrozo@gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAAre=ySbA-JaAZoU1AsGHTZoYOwkeiRnfkYPjMV6yEa_r+SYKA@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 07:13:13 -0700
Message-Id: <504EA5F5-FCC8-4438-BF1D-7908E07D4061@gmail.com>
References: <CAPg+sBjOj9eXiDG0F6G54SVKkStF_1HRu2wzGqtFF5X_NAWy4w@mail.gmail.com>
	<20150627074259.GA25420@amethyst.visucore.com>
	<20150627095501.C59B541A40@smtp.hushmail.com>
	<20150627100400.GC25420@amethyst.visucore.com>
	<20150627102912.06E2641A3E@smtp.hushmail.com>
	<CABm2gDpnzjph5SKTf+8GWgwe+njS=k2GNm9uL73RC-EV=Y5wug@mail.gmail.com>
	<20150627121016.2360041A3E@smtp.hushmail.com>
	<CABm2gDovynxmZmf_voz-19mmb5k0R4Snxcucx-WObt_stkAL9A@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAre=ySbA-JaAZoU1AsGHTZoYOwkeiRnfkYPjMV6yEa_r+SYKA@mail.gmail.com>
To: Ivan Brightly <ibrightly@gmail.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.2098)
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED,
	DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU, FREEMAIL_FROM, HTML_MESSAGE,
	RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW, URIBL_BLACK autolearn=no version=3.3.1
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on
	smtp1.linux-foundation.org
Cc: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] The need for larger blocks
X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Bitcoin Development Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>,
	<mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/>
List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>,
	<mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 14:13:19 -0000


--Apple-Mail=_07E2AF13-0263-411C-AABC-31F7555FE88F
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
	boundary="Apple-Mail=_3F86680B-2DCD-442E-89DE-F5386D6AE2F9"


--Apple-Mail=_3F86680B-2DCD-442E-89DE-F5386D6AE2F9
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset=utf-8

Either one branch wins overwhelmingly in a relatively short period of =
time=E2=80=A6or both branches lose, I think.

- Eric

> On Jun 28, 2015, at 6:51 AM, Ivan Brightly <ibrightly@gmail.com> =
wrote:
>=20
> On Sun, Jun 28, 2015 at 8:13 AM, Jorge Tim=C3=B3n <jtimon@jtimon.cc =
<mailto:jtimon@jtimon.cc>> wrote:
>=20
> No, this is very important. The majority has no right to dictate on
> the minority.
>=20
> While an interesting philosophical question, I don't think that this =
is accurate. First off, bitcoin doesn't imbue  any 'rights' on =
individuals - it provides the choice of participating or not, nothing =
more.
>=20
> Secondly, from a technical perspective, how is it that the majority =
(or super-majority) are prevented from imposing their will? The best =
answer is that they are incentivized to not override a minority group =
since that reduces the inherent value in the system. However, presuming =
that the majority calculate that the reward for imposing a change is =
greater than the value lost in such disruption, I don't see how there =
would be any stopping this change. The longest chain with the greatest =
number of users valuing the token on that chain "wins".
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev


--Apple-Mail=_3F86680B-2DCD-442E-89DE-F5386D6AE2F9
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset=utf-8

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">Either one branch wins overwhelmingly in a relatively short =
period of time=E2=80=A6or both branches lose, I think.<div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">- Eric</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Jun 28, 2015, at 6:51 AM, Ivan Brightly &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:ibrightly@gmail.com" class=3D"">ibrightly@gmail.com</a>&gt;=
 wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div =
class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sun, Jun 28, 2015 at 8:13 AM, Jorge Tim=C3=B3n =
<span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jtimon@jtimon.cc" =
target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">jtimon@jtimon.cc</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br =
class=3D""><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 =
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><br class=3D"">
No, this is very important. The majority has no right to dictate on<br =
class=3D"">
the minority.<br class=3D""></blockquote><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">While an interesting philosophical =
question, I don't think that this is accurate. First off, bitcoin =
doesn't imbue &nbsp;any 'rights' on individuals - it provides the choice =
of participating or not, nothing more.</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Secondly, from a technical perspective, =
how is it that the majority (or super-majority) are prevented from =
imposing their will? The best answer is that they are incentivized to =
not override a minority group since that reduces the inherent value in =
the system. However, presuming that the majority calculate that the =
reward for imposing a change is greater than the value lost in such =
disruption, I don't see how there would be any stopping this change. The =
longest chain with the greatest number of users valuing the token on =
that chain "wins".</div></div><br class=3D""></div></div>
_______________________________________________<br class=3D"">bitcoin-dev =
mailing list<br class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" =
class=3D"">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a><br =
class=3D"">https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev<=
br class=3D""></div></blockquote></div><br =
class=3D""></div></div></body></html>=

--Apple-Mail=_3F86680B-2DCD-442E-89DE-F5386D6AE2F9--

--Apple-Mail=_07E2AF13-0263-411C-AABC-31F7555FE88F
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: attachment;
	filename=signature.asc
Content-Type: application/pgp-signature;
	name=signature.asc
Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Comment: GPGTools - https://gpgtools.org
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=5vIX
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

--Apple-Mail=_07E2AF13-0263-411C-AABC-31F7555FE88F--