1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
129
130
131
132
133
134
135
136
137
138
139
140
141
142
143
144
145
146
147
148
149
150
151
152
153
154
155
156
157
158
159
160
161
162
163
164
165
166
167
168
169
170
171
172
173
174
175
176
177
178
179
180
181
182
183
184
185
186
187
188
189
190
191
192
193
194
195
196
197
198
199
200
201
202
203
204
205
206
207
208
209
210
211
212
213
214
215
216
217
218
219
220
221
222
223
224
225
226
227
228
229
230
231
232
233
234
235
236
237
238
239
240
241
242
243
244
245
246
247
248
249
250
251
252
253
254
255
256
257
258
259
260
261
262
263
264
265
266
267
268
269
270
271
272
273
274
275
276
277
278
279
280
281
282
283
284
285
286
287
288
289
290
291
292
293
294
295
296
297
298
299
300
301
302
303
304
305
306
307
308
309
310
311
312
313
314
315
316
317
318
319
320
321
322
323
324
325
326
327
|
Return-Path: <jlrubin@mit.edu>
Received: from smtp1.osuosl.org (smtp1.osuosl.org [IPv6:2605:bc80:3010::138])
by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDAF7C002F
for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
Mon, 17 Jan 2022 22:38:28 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])
by smtp1.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9ADD8140E
for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
Mon, 17 Jan 2022 22:38:28 +0000 (UTC)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -4.199
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5
tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3,
SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from smtp1.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1])
by localhost (smtp1.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024)
with ESMTP id PymBGaGGOPYv
for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
Mon, 17 Jan 2022 22:38:27 +0000 (UTC)
X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0
Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (outgoing-auth-1.mit.edu [18.9.28.11])
by smtp1.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6557081403
for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
Mon, 17 Jan 2022 22:38:27 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from mail-lf1-f52.google.com (mail-lf1-f52.google.com
[209.85.167.52]) (authenticated bits=0)
(User authenticated as jlrubin@ATHENA.MIT.EDU)
by outgoing.mit.edu (8.14.7/8.12.4) with ESMTP id 20HMcOTu031495
(version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128 verify=NOT)
for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>; Mon, 17 Jan 2022 17:38:25 -0500
Received: by mail-lf1-f52.google.com with SMTP id e3so60417731lfc.9
for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
Mon, 17 Jan 2022 14:38:25 -0800 (PST)
X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533S2p890GV2zICHKm7UlXnNXPSopbS0OKyc8c616gy8lhHpa5kg
8T9VuZ21W4DzMOXMV/lKrQcWjDa7VUSZE2JwSow=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyO+xdsp0m1Jd2qsHm1lJGR/TEBIOmSM+h3H7Swzm4XRI8tsZEdbTrRhQIf3XxQAcwI5Ifq8wPuQ7EODxHPNzU=
X-Received: by 2002:a2e:a166:: with SMTP id u6mr17784679ljl.227.1642459103855;
Mon, 17 Jan 2022 14:38:23 -0800 (PST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <CAJowKg+Wr0agLLGfCB=yAJrUn0tXWieyuoz2TFv6W1Ahj8Td2w@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAJowKg+Wr0agLLGfCB=yAJrUn0tXWieyuoz2TFv6W1Ahj8Td2w@mail.gmail.com>
From: Jeremy <jlrubin@mit.edu>
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2022 14:38:12 -0800
X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: <CAD5xwhhOP_evDPGhEWq6UL9_xuYUCAQs7CCttVCKcdf5V5CdFw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAD5xwhhOP_evDPGhEWq6UL9_xuYUCAQs7CCttVCKcdf5V5CdFw@mail.gmail.com>
To: Erik Aronesty <erik@q32.com>,
Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000071880305d5cecf68"
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] bip39
X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>,
<mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/>
List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>,
<mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2022 22:38:28 -0000
--00000000000071880305d5cecf68
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
This is a good point, but can be addressed by having a non-void whitespace
character (e.g., win x estate).
changing BIP39 would be hard since software expects a standard list; it
would also be possible to rejection sample for seeds that do not contain
these pairs, unclear how much entropy would be lost from that.
--
@JeremyRubin <https://twitter.com/JeremyRubin>
<https://twitter.com/JeremyRubin>
On Mon, Jan 17, 2022 at 2:26 PM Erik Aronesty via bitcoin-dev <
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> really don't like that art, work, and artwork are 3 different words
>
> would be nice to clean up adjacent ambiguity
>
> it's not a big deal, but it can lead to confusion when writing things down
>
>
> dup: ('canal', 'arm') ('can', 'alarm')
> dup: ('canal', 'one') ('can', 'alone')
> dup: ('canal', 'ready') ('can', 'already')
> dup: ('card', 'anger') ('car', 'danger')
> dup: ('card', 'ice') ('car', 'dice')
> dup: ('card', 'inner') ('car', 'dinner')
> dup: ('card', 'raw') ('car', 'draw')
> dup: ('cart', 'able') ('car', 'table')
> dup: ('cart', 'ask') ('car', 'task')
> dup: ('cart', 'hat') ('car', 'that')
> dup: ('cart', 'hen') ('car', 'then')
> dup: ('cart', 'issue') ('car', 'tissue')
> dup: ('cart', 'one') ('car', 'tone')
> dup: ('cart', 'own') ('car', 'town')
> dup: ('cart', 'rack') ('car', 'track')
> dup: ('cart', 'rain') ('car', 'train')
> dup: ('cart', 'win') ('car', 'twin')
> dup: ('catch', 'air') ('cat', 'chair')
> dup: ('erase', 'arch') ('era', 'search')
> dup: ('fatal', 'arm') ('fat', 'alarm')
> dup: ('fatal', 'one') ('fat', 'alone')
> dup: ('fatal', 'ready') ('fat', 'already')
> dup: ('feed', 'anger') ('fee', 'danger')
> dup: ('feed', 'ice') ('fee', 'dice')
> dup: ('feed', 'inner') ('fee', 'dinner')
> dup: ('feed', 'raw') ('fee', 'draw')
> dup: ('feel', 'earn') ('fee', 'learn')
> dup: ('feel', 'end') ('fee', 'lend')
> dup: ('gasp', 'act') ('gas', 'pact')
> dup: ('gasp', 'age') ('gas', 'page')
> dup: ('gasp', 'air') ('gas', 'pair')
> dup: ('gasp', 'ill') ('gas', 'pill')
> dup: ('gasp', 'raise') ('gas', 'praise')
> dup: ('gasp', 'rice') ('gas', 'price')
> dup: ('gasp', 'ride') ('gas', 'pride')
> dup: ('gasp', 'roof') ('gas', 'proof')
> dup: ('kite', 'merge') ('kit', 'emerge')
> dup: ('kite', 'motion') ('kit', 'emotion')
> dup: ('kite', 'state') ('kit', 'estate')
> dup: ('lawn', 'arrow') ('law', 'narrow')
> dup: ('lawn', 'either') ('law', 'neither')
> dup: ('lawn', 'ice') ('law', 'nice')
> dup: ('legal', 'arm') ('leg', 'alarm')
> dup: ('legal', 'one') ('leg', 'alone')
> dup: ('legal', 'ready') ('leg', 'already')
> dup: ('seat', 'able') ('sea', 'table')
> dup: ('seat', 'ask') ('sea', 'task')
> dup: ('seat', 'hat') ('sea', 'that')
> dup: ('seat', 'hen') ('sea', 'then')
> dup: ('seat', 'issue') ('sea', 'tissue')
> dup: ('seat', 'one') ('sea', 'tone')
> dup: ('seat', 'own') ('sea', 'town')
> dup: ('seat', 'rack') ('sea', 'track')
> dup: ('seat', 'rain') ('sea', 'train')
> dup: ('seat', 'win') ('sea', 'twin')
> dup: ('skin', 'arrow') ('ski', 'narrow')
> dup: ('skin', 'either') ('ski', 'neither')
> dup: ('skin', 'ice') ('ski', 'nice')
> dup: ('tent', 'able') ('ten', 'table')
> dup: ('tent', 'ask') ('ten', 'task')
> dup: ('tent', 'hat') ('ten', 'that')
> dup: ('tent', 'hen') ('ten', 'then')
> dup: ('tent', 'issue') ('ten', 'tissue')
> dup: ('tent', 'one') ('ten', 'tone')
> dup: ('tent', 'own') ('ten', 'town')
> dup: ('tent', 'rack') ('ten', 'track')
> dup: ('tent', 'rain') ('ten', 'train')
> dup: ('tent', 'win') ('ten', 'twin')
> dup: ('used', 'anger') ('use', 'danger')
> dup: ('used', 'ice') ('use', 'dice')
> dup: ('used', 'inner') ('use', 'dinner')
> dup: ('used', 'raw') ('use', 'draw')
> dup: ('wine', 'merge') ('win', 'emerge')
> dup: ('wine', 'motion') ('win', 'emotion')
> dup: ('wine', 'state') ('win', 'estate')
> dup: ('wing', 'host') ('win', 'ghost')
> dup: ('wing', 'love') ('win', 'glove')
> dup: ('wing', 'old') ('win', 'gold')
> dup: ('wing', 'own') ('win', 'gown')
> dup: ('wing', 'race') ('win', 'grace')
> dup: ('wing', 'rain') ('win', 'grain')
> dup: ('wink', 'now') ('win', 'know')
> dup: ('youth', 'under') ('you', 'thunder')
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
--00000000000071880305d5cecf68
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,he=
lvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000">This is a good point, but=
can be addressed=C2=A0by having a non-void whitespace character (e.g., win=
x estate).</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,he=
lvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#000000"><br></div><div class=3D"g=
mail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:sma=
ll;color:#000000">changing BIP39 would be hard since software expects a sta=
ndard list; it would also be possible to rejection sample for seeds that do=
not contain these pairs, unclear how much entropy would be lost from that.=
</div><div><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" data-smartmail=3D"gma=
il_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr">--<br><a href=3D"https://twitter.com/JeremyR=
ubin" target=3D"_blank">@JeremyRubin</a><a href=3D"https://twitter.com/Jere=
myRubin" target=3D"_blank"></a></div></div></div><br></div><br><div class=
=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Jan 17, 2022=
at 2:26 PM Erik Aronesty via bitcoin-dev <<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev=
@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>> w=
rote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0p=
x 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb=
(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">really don't like that art, work, and a=
rtwork are 3 different words<br>
<br>
would be nice to clean up adjacent ambiguity<br>
<br>
it's not a big deal, but it can lead to confusion when writing things d=
own<br>
<br>
<br>
dup: ('canal', 'arm') ('can', 'alarm')<br>
dup: ('canal', 'one') ('can', 'alone')<br>
dup: ('canal', 'ready') ('can', 'already')<=
br>
dup: ('card', 'anger') ('car', 'danger')<br=
>
dup: ('card', 'ice') ('car', 'dice')<br>
dup: ('card', 'inner') ('car', 'dinner')<br=
>
dup: ('card', 'raw') ('car', 'draw')<br>
dup: ('cart', 'able') ('car', 'table')<br>
dup: ('cart', 'ask') ('car', 'task')<br>
dup: ('cart', 'hat') ('car', 'that')<br>
dup: ('cart', 'hen') ('car', 'then')<br>
dup: ('cart', 'issue') ('car', 'tissue')<br=
>
dup: ('cart', 'one') ('car', 'tone')<br>
dup: ('cart', 'own') ('car', 'town')<br>
dup: ('cart', 'rack') ('car', 'track')<br>
dup: ('cart', 'rain') ('car', 'train')<br>
dup: ('cart', 'win') ('car', 'twin')<br>
dup: ('catch', 'air') ('cat', 'chair')<br>
dup: ('erase', 'arch') ('era', 'search')<br=
>
dup: ('fatal', 'arm') ('fat', 'alarm')<br>
dup: ('fatal', 'one') ('fat', 'alone')<br>
dup: ('fatal', 'ready') ('fat', 'already')<=
br>
dup: ('feed', 'anger') ('fee', 'danger')<br=
>
dup: ('feed', 'ice') ('fee', 'dice')<br>
dup: ('feed', 'inner') ('fee', 'dinner')<br=
>
dup: ('feed', 'raw') ('fee', 'draw')<br>
dup: ('feel', 'earn') ('fee', 'learn')<br>
dup: ('feel', 'end') ('fee', 'lend')<br>
dup: ('gasp', 'act') ('gas', 'pact')<br>
dup: ('gasp', 'age') ('gas', 'page')<br>
dup: ('gasp', 'air') ('gas', 'pair')<br>
dup: ('gasp', 'ill') ('gas', 'pill')<br>
dup: ('gasp', 'raise') ('gas', 'praise')<br=
>
dup: ('gasp', 'rice') ('gas', 'price')<br>
dup: ('gasp', 'ride') ('gas', 'pride')<br>
dup: ('gasp', 'roof') ('gas', 'proof')<br>
dup: ('kite', 'merge') ('kit', 'emerge')<br=
>
dup: ('kite', 'motion') ('kit', 'emotion')<=
br>
dup: ('kite', 'state') ('kit', 'estate')<br=
>
dup: ('lawn', 'arrow') ('law', 'narrow')<br=
>
dup: ('lawn', 'either') ('law', 'neither')<=
br>
dup: ('lawn', 'ice') ('law', 'nice')<br>
dup: ('legal', 'arm') ('leg', 'alarm')<br>
dup: ('legal', 'one') ('leg', 'alone')<br>
dup: ('legal', 'ready') ('leg', 'already')<=
br>
dup: ('seat', 'able') ('sea', 'table')<br>
dup: ('seat', 'ask') ('sea', 'task')<br>
dup: ('seat', 'hat') ('sea', 'that')<br>
dup: ('seat', 'hen') ('sea', 'then')<br>
dup: ('seat', 'issue') ('sea', 'tissue')<br=
>
dup: ('seat', 'one') ('sea', 'tone')<br>
dup: ('seat', 'own') ('sea', 'town')<br>
dup: ('seat', 'rack') ('sea', 'track')<br>
dup: ('seat', 'rain') ('sea', 'train')<br>
dup: ('seat', 'win') ('sea', 'twin')<br>
dup: ('skin', 'arrow') ('ski', 'narrow')<br=
>
dup: ('skin', 'either') ('ski', 'neither')<=
br>
dup: ('skin', 'ice') ('ski', 'nice')<br>
dup: ('tent', 'able') ('ten', 'table')<br>
dup: ('tent', 'ask') ('ten', 'task')<br>
dup: ('tent', 'hat') ('ten', 'that')<br>
dup: ('tent', 'hen') ('ten', 'then')<br>
dup: ('tent', 'issue') ('ten', 'tissue')<br=
>
dup: ('tent', 'one') ('ten', 'tone')<br>
dup: ('tent', 'own') ('ten', 'town')<br>
dup: ('tent', 'rack') ('ten', 'track')<br>
dup: ('tent', 'rain') ('ten', 'train')<br>
dup: ('tent', 'win') ('ten', 'twin')<br>
dup: ('used', 'anger') ('use', 'danger')<br=
>
dup: ('used', 'ice') ('use', 'dice')<br>
dup: ('used', 'inner') ('use', 'dinner')<br=
>
dup: ('used', 'raw') ('use', 'draw')<br>
dup: ('wine', 'merge') ('win', 'emerge')<br=
>
dup: ('wine', 'motion') ('win', 'emotion')<=
br>
dup: ('wine', 'state') ('win', 'estate')<br=
>
dup: ('wing', 'host') ('win', 'ghost')<br>
dup: ('wing', 'love') ('win', 'glove')<br>
dup: ('wing', 'old') ('win', 'gold')<br>
dup: ('wing', 'own') ('win', 'gown')<br>
dup: ('wing', 'race') ('win', 'grace')<br>
dup: ('wing', 'rain') ('win', 'grain')<br>
dup: ('wink', 'now') ('win', 'know')<br>
dup: ('youth', 'under') ('you', 'thunder')<=
br>
_______________________________________________<br>
bitcoin-dev mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank">=
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" =
rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mail=
man/listinfo/bitcoin-dev</a><br>
</blockquote></div>
--00000000000071880305d5cecf68--
|
