summaryrefslogtreecommitdiff
path: root/14/38657ecd691306088d9f35555844f7bee87382
blob: 7aa71b60e7c97f61cd9f0d234eea6e6364e5ada6 (plain)
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
129
130
131
132
133
134
135
136
137
138
139
140
Return-Path: <ibrightly@gmail.com>
Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org
	[172.17.192.35])
	by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0EF6F305
	for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
	Sun, 28 Jun 2015 16:01:33 +0000 (UTC)
X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6
Received: from mail-ob0-f176.google.com (mail-ob0-f176.google.com
	[209.85.214.176])
	by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7EC88A7
	for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
	Sun, 28 Jun 2015 16:01:32 +0000 (UTC)
Received: by obbop1 with SMTP id op1so91661314obb.2
	for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
	Sun, 28 Jun 2015 09:01:32 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113;
	h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to
	:cc:content-type;
	bh=E/G2pm2z2FkiMWiQ9BTxPmiIm4hKCIwHCyp4JclMFeA=;
	b=EjgiIemYZVTiYIbI6jJNoGYGLF9Y861UlgnFOAamRYWVaOPSxiYNituj4DIKZddbDr
	xbcKmzKD66wio2HM1awHj/Cjsg43W8TECikW4Nqwh0JPu792L1a8cSzSoz/slZt1hUHA
	yv20CAWHdJdHCeMP+2d6KNq+lh7bS4kofYLRs2Fqk8OlAsBL1VL6DJwe0TuhAUqTL0cn
	9yYXWtoalnIO8+DuWhWe5bcmkcp0xdpY9EQUH6Y7L+BBuu2G8tHofLZZ1RgVf//LMXHQ
	Ggwbx/6bvoxIEw/Dwx8z8QzMTTUDMZCny+aDN56fx4qO3Y693eTmRZk9KyUCC8/rb5/+
	NOSw==
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Received: by 10.202.202.200 with SMTP id a191mr9750874oig.118.1435507291924; 
	Sun, 28 Jun 2015 09:01:31 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.76.177.164 with HTTP; Sun, 28 Jun 2015 09:01:31 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <CABm2gDo8ZmEO5SHwZVLX0Ajg3vUu2OoJkz2urA61wAoVm_f+zA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPg+sBjOj9eXiDG0F6G54SVKkStF_1HRu2wzGqtFF5X_NAWy4w@mail.gmail.com>
	<20150627074259.GA25420@amethyst.visucore.com>
	<20150627095501.C59B541A40@smtp.hushmail.com>
	<20150627100400.GC25420@amethyst.visucore.com>
	<20150627102912.06E2641A3E@smtp.hushmail.com>
	<CABm2gDpnzjph5SKTf+8GWgwe+njS=k2GNm9uL73RC-EV=Y5wug@mail.gmail.com>
	<20150627121016.2360041A3E@smtp.hushmail.com>
	<CABm2gDovynxmZmf_voz-19mmb5k0R4Snxcucx-WObt_stkAL9A@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAre=ySbA-JaAZoU1AsGHTZoYOwkeiRnfkYPjMV6yEa_r+SYKA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CABm2gDo8ZmEO5SHwZVLX0Ajg3vUu2OoJkz2urA61wAoVm_f+zA@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 12:01:31 -0400
Message-ID: <CAAre=yQvp68CaWmGfBGhehxAdz2HJGYU0nuxrn+wskyRYFfcSQ@mail.gmail.com>
From: Ivan Brightly <ibrightly@gmail.com>
To: =?UTF-8?B?Sm9yZ2UgVGltw7Nu?= <jtimon@jtimon.cc>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1134ecd6352fdc0519961661
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED,
	DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU, FREEMAIL_FROM, HTML_MESSAGE,
	RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW, URIBL_BLACK autolearn=no version=3.3.1
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on
	smtp1.linux-foundation.org
Cc: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] The need for larger blocks
X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Bitcoin Development Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>,
	<mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/>
List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>,
	<mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 16:01:33 -0000

--001a1134ecd6352fdc0519961661
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I don't think that rights are a pillar of how bitcoin works - rather I
would say it's a matter of aligned incentives. The fact is that the
majority technically *can* dictate through PoW and acceptance. The only
reason that the majority would not chose this path is because there is
greater economic value in consensus, whether perceived or realized.

If bitcoin were about "doing the right thing" there wouldn't be a need for
PoW since no individual would be incentivized to double spend.

On Sun, Jun 28, 2015 at 11:05 AM, Jorge Tim=C3=B3n <jtimon@jtimon.cc> wrote=
:

> On Sun, Jun 28, 2015 at 3:51 PM, Ivan Brightly <ibrightly@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > On Sun, Jun 28, 2015 at 8:13 AM, Jorge Tim=C3=B3n <jtimon@jtimon.cc> wr=
ote:
> >>
> >>
> >> No, this is very important. The majority has no right to dictate on
> >> the minority.
> >
> >
> > While an interesting philosophical question, I don't think that this is
> > accurate. First off, bitcoin doesn't imbue  any 'rights' on individuals
> - it
> > provides the choice of participating or not, nothing more.
>
> I think you're not contradicting me: ff there's not rights built into
> the system, the majority has no "right to dictate" anything.
>

--001a1134ecd6352fdc0519961661
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">I don&#39;t think that rights are a pillar of how bitcoin =
works - rather I would say it&#39;s a matter of aligned incentives. The fac=
t is that the majority technically *can* dictate through PoW and acceptance=
. The only reason that the majority would not chose this path is because th=
ere is greater economic value in consensus, whether perceived or realized.<=
div><br></div><div>If bitcoin were about &quot;doing the right thing&quot; =
there wouldn&#39;t be a need for PoW since no individual would be incentivi=
zed to double spend.</div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=
=3D"gmail_quote">On Sun, Jun 28, 2015 at 11:05 AM, Jorge Tim=C3=B3n <span d=
ir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jtimon@jtimon.cc" target=3D"_blank">jtimon=
@jtimon.cc</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">On Sun, =
Jun 28, 2015 at 3:51 PM, Ivan Brightly &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ibrightly@gmai=
l.com">ibrightly@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; On Sun, Jun 28, 2015 at 8:13 AM, Jorge Tim=C3=B3n &lt;jtimon@jtimon.cc=
&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; No, this is very important. The majority has no right to dictate o=
n<br>
&gt;&gt; the minority.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; While an interesting philosophical question, I don&#39;t think that th=
is is<br>
&gt; accurate. First off, bitcoin doesn&#39;t imbue=C2=A0 any &#39;rights&#=
39; on individuals - it<br>
&gt; provides the choice of participating or not, nothing more.<br>
<br>
I think you&#39;re not contradicting me: ff there&#39;s not rights built in=
to<br>
the system, the majority has no &quot;right to dictate&quot; anything.<br>
</blockquote></div><br></div>

--001a1134ecd6352fdc0519961661--