From: Ross A. Finlayson (extropy@apexinternetsoftware.com)
Date: Sat Sep 07 2002 - 19:29:25 MDT
On Thursday, August 1, 2002, at 08:34 AM, John K Clark wrote:
> "Damien Sullivan" <phoenix@ugcs.caltech.edu> Wrote:
>
>> Last I heard the attack would probably be in October
>
> I don't see how it could possibly be that soon, it took 6 moths to
> prepare
> for desert storm. And trying to do it on the cheap with some clever
> small
> scale surprise move would be a bad idea, it might work but then again it
> might not. The price of failure it too great, so if you decide to invade
> Iraq (and I'm not convinced it's a good idea) overwhelming force should
> be immediately available so you can smoothly go to plan B if it turns
> out that plan A is not working. In war you never know.
>
> John K Clark jonkc@att.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
It would cost billions and billions and even billions of dollars.
That's not an investment, it's an expense. It would involve levels of
urban fighting not seen by U.S. forces. Many Iraqi civilians would be
at high risk. Success is not assured. Concentrated air defenses imply
losses in an air campaign.
It would not reduce risk to Americans and Europeans. Indeed it would
only cement hatred.
Hussein invaded Kuwait because Kuwait slant-drilled into the southwest
Iraqi oilfields and stole much of their reserves there. That
slant-drilling is quasi-legal, Harken Energy was one of the contractors
on the theft. Hussein had expected to drill those rich reserves under
his territory after the ten long year war against the Iranians, where
Iran and Iraq fought, financed on each side by U.S. taxpayers without
their knowledge.
The United States invaded Kuwait after Iraq invaded Kuwait.
Many U.S. troops suffer from "Gulf War syndrome". I surmise it was
caused by "chemical weapon" repellant. Hussein didn't use chemical
weapons against the U.S. in the Gulf War. The United States delivered
to Iraq some of their chemical weapons: from the massive stockpiles
chemical weapons were sent to Iraq for Hussein to use against Iran in
the Iran-Iraq war. Both Iran and Iraq gassed the Kurds, the Turks just
beat them down, Kurdistan. In Vietnam "Agent Orange" was a used as a
chemical defoliant and a bunch of vets got strange diseases from
exposure to U.S. chemical agents, infant mortality and congenital birth
defects in Vietnam and Southeast Asia were caused in part by U.S.
unconventional warfare.
Bush, Shrub, is kind of a patsy. Do a web search for "unelected".
The Taliban was a restrictive, even draconian, fundamentalist religious
"regime". It was noted on this list how they were making non-Muslims
wear identifying clothing, that's a thing equated with evil fascists.
Also the Taliban was wrong in subjugating their women, women deserve
equal rights. Under the Taliban heroin output from Afghanistan dropped
very significantly. After the World Trade Center attacks, the Taliban
was toppled by the United States starting bombing and all the Taliban
abandoned the Taliban and went back to their tribal identities.
Months before that, there was something about a "carpet of gold or
carpet of bombs" statement with regards to some oil pipeline.
The Taliban was claimed to be attacked for being linked to "al-Qaeda",
a tenebrous and shadowy terrorist organization. Osama or Usama bin
Laden was claimed to be the leader of the al-Qaeda which he may well
have been. He wasn't the leader of the Taliban, he just gave them lots
of money. Bin Laden needs to be captured and brought to actual justice
under suspicion of foreknowledge and conspiracy to commit some three
thousand or more murders. The first thing I heard about from bin Laden
after the September 11 atrocity was his denial of involvement.
Prior to being the most wanted criminal, bin Laden had over years been
an agent of the CIA and other groups, organizing mujahedeen against the
Soviet offensive in Afghanistan. That is to say, he was paid by us to
organize guerrilla actions. Bin Laden is from a wealthy and prominent
Saudi family. Bring him back alive, and let everyone ask him questions,
that would be just.
Oil: filthy lucre, black gold, Texas tea. People depend on petroleum
products to fuel their vehicles.
Mexico and Venezuela have huge reserves of oil. That guy Chavez, the
elected leader of Venezuela, he was almost deposed, but not quite. He
blamed some American meddling among his disenfranchisement of the rich.
It angers me sometimes to see that "the U.S." did something or has some
stand when it wasn't you or me but rather some snot-nosed suit next door
to the White House putting out a "press release".
Anyways I'm against invading Iraq, as are most people in consideration
of a hostile occupation: against, not not for, against.
There's a lot of of domestic stuff that needs attention here: deficit,
corporate malfeasance, government accountability, drug relegalization,
access to higher education, environmental conservation, encouragement,
and sustainability, helping people out of poverty, ensuring fair
entitlements (see deficit), colonizing space, etcetera. Some day we
have to economically compete with the rest of the world. Notice that
I'm unconcerned about security.
Ross Finlayson, U.S.A.
America, Land of Free and Home of Brave
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Sat Nov 02 2002 - 09:16:50 MST