From: Forrest Bishop (forrestb@ix.netcom.com)
Date: Fri Apr 12 2002 - 14:40:00 MDT
----- Original Message -----
From: Harvey Newstrom <mail@HarveyNewstrom.com>
To: <extropians@extropy.org>
Sent: Friday, April 12, 2002 12:38 PM
Subject: Re: POLITICS: Re: grim prospects
>
> On Friday, April 12, 2002, at 02:29 pm, CurtAdams@aol.com wrote:
>
> >
> > In a message dated 4/12/02 8:23:18, mail@HarveyNewstrom.com writes:
> >
> >> Even in a war, there has to be a pretty clear and present danger before
> >> the military is allowed to fire upon unarmed civilians. I really can't
> >> believe I am the only one who believes this.
> >
> > Don't worry, Harvey, you're not, you're just doing a great job so
> > there's
> > no need for me-toos.
>
> I wish I felt like I was doing a good job, but lately I feel like it is
> a losing battle. I seriously think I see more anti-freedom,
> anti-rights, anti-speech rheteric here than calls for freedom. I see
> more support for initiating force at the slightest imagined wrong rather
> than calls for evenhandedness. There is more classism, nationalism,
> pro-government, pro-military, anti-individual support than I ever
> imagined could survive here. I even see more pseudo-science and
> religious faith in unverified conjecture than real technical
> possibilities. People seem to be just making up ideas for propaganda
> value rather than concerning themselves with real research, validation
> and facts. It is getting harder and harder to justify putting any
> energy into this movement when is seems to becoming more destructive and
> less scientific. This discussion list seems to have little to do with
> the Extropian Principles, the Scientific Method, or even logical
> thought. Politics and propaganda seem to have become the primary
> purpose for most participants.
Chin up, Harvey. As several noted, most of this thread is armchair generals discussing which nut-case has the more just cause.
Americans go through regular psychohistoric cycles of 'national psychoses', sometimes called Jubilee, Kondratieff Winter, or Fourth
Turning. We are in such a period; this too will pass.
As a side note, I did consider compiling some portion of my "real research, validation and fact" on the 'tax scam' issue for your
information, as this is a field(s) I have devoted considerable resources to. Maybe a different day.
Forrest
-- Forrest Bishop Chairman, Institute of Atomic-Scale Engineering www.iase.cc
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