From: Dan Fabulich (daniel.fabulich@yale.edu)
Date: Sun Mar 26 2000 - 16:14:56 MST
'What is your name?' 'Michael S. Lorrey.' 'Do you deny having written
the following?':
> Not until you say:"Some things are considered good and bad subjectively,
> but there are some objective, universal thruths, to which all other
> things can be compared as a matter of relativity, or as subjective to
> those objcetive truths." This cuts the knot. At this point, anyone who
> still thinks all things are subjective looks foolish, because there ARE
> universal thruths: gravity, relativity, tanstaafl, etc.
I'm as big a fan of objectivity as the rest of 'em, but I don't think this
argument works. Certainly, the subjectivist looks like a fool, but we
objectivity fans have ALWAYS had the upper hand as far as popularity is
concerned. ;)
Your assertion that there are univeral thruths doesn't let you jump out of
your own perspective any more than writing down all your beliefs in
symbolic logic does. Any subjectivist could reply to this argument: "but
is it only a subjective truth that there are thruths? If so, mightn't
there be thruths for *you* which are radically different from *my*
thruths? Or no thruths for *me* at all?"
I don't take there to be a good (read: useful) argument against a
self-described subjectivist. I also don't take there to be a good
argument against us. The subjectivist sees the objectivist as trying to
employ a kind of skyhook to lift herself upwards and out of her own
perspective to reach the objective context-independent truths; the
subjectivist then goes on to report that all the hooks proposed thus far
fail to fit that bill. But rather than coming to terms with this and
remaining open-mindedly committed to the truths which he already holds,
the subjectivist embraces a NEW skyhook: relativism.
But the moral of subjectivism is to maintain your own point of view with
an open mind, NOT to reject all points of view. After all we've learned,
you'd think the subjectivist would have managed to avoid falling into this
trap. But many of them haven't... instead going on to make claims which
could only be made from no one's perspective, from the God's eye view, the
view from nowhere. "Morality is both subjective AND objective! Ha ha!
I've thought my way up, out and above this debate!" If THAT'S what you
got out of subjectivism, you've missed the point entirely.
In the end, we have to accept that our view is basically right, and work
from there. If you disagree with me about something, don't try to climb
your way out of the dilemma. Converse with me. That's how we learn and
grow.
-Dan
-unless you love someone-
-nothing else makes any sense-
e.e. cummings
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