summaryrefslogtreecommitdiff
path: root/cf/bb8caec78861a19ae8862be41d4f1a5f4559f4
blob: a52237347e6602de3a7c50f2dcf6b045d10f48f9 (plain)
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
Received: from sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.193]
	helo=mx.sourceforge.net)
	by sfs-ml-1.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76)
	(envelope-from <jgarzik@bitpay.com>) id 1Z4Xz6-0000RO-0O
	for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net;
	Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:15:44 +0000
Received-SPF: pass (sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com: domain of bitpay.com
	designates 209.85.218.54 as permitted sender)
	client-ip=209.85.218.54; envelope-from=jgarzik@bitpay.com;
	helo=mail-oi0-f54.google.com; 
Received: from mail-oi0-f54.google.com ([209.85.218.54])
	by sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128)
	(Exim 4.76) id 1Z4Xz2-0005sp-Do
	for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net;
	Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:15:43 +0000
Received: by oial131 with SMTP id l131so30352030oia.3
	for <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>;
	Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:15:35 -0700 (PDT)
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
	d=1e100.net; s=20130820;
	h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date
	:message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type;
	bh=xi6/8SigapEiAwBqHDlQIMIUD46siO8TdwUtiEV7nVk=;
	b=EkEgUaJBgrOqhZJUg3LxiZM6DDWEIf+UgtIEDaS9V4Y4sBASJ6KzmU1CRZDU/wzG91
	kddHlvlzrX3h+qLBjn18XjFTRfO+LobpKufubevwDruJLVyHMPJlOP5RWfh9P8t9Ansv
	RsNmgjQo+c+Zxq1rZHHgVPfKwYBmi4+3ELx4abirEtUOmZNG3II6AG9yB989688sK/gy
	3ottEXfAcq3ugKJwgbEtPiaTzZ9TH9eIpLTKZj5GlwSg6yVeXgLRm3IMZzy9C6YqeRQd
	XcnJLnn3YKADIjrJ9mwYVyqTlWw4+7ue6kEPbi5h9FX2mNEIw8B68vCUQSKou3hSqJIC
	NzdA==
X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQkecrGceedY2zjLQ4QqZU6+x2nrkmoCnZBpYG6h0cpGg9aBJlaWUQKDRzSNfdsjiTBu0J2c
X-Received: by 10.202.83.83 with SMTP id h80mr23286413oib.56.1434388534996;
	Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:15:34 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.202.108.149 with HTTP; Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:15:14 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <CAPg+sBjrSed4r+8-d2RGBVhbzaXxX+o=qqw2u-2jpF2RUqmEmA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAL8tG==LG=xC_DzOaghbGGKab4=UVpGLQV7781pU4wg+WnFdMg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAPg+sBjqQ66f1Rmhi9HOBYP5BDjBHvTNPpUN-y3o-KX8dXBMhg@mail.gmail.com>
	<557D2571.601@gmail.com>
	<CAL8tG=kEv9AfQM+1Rv+tqBujFEjCp+BsjQ-1s7eJC-usogFFqw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAPg+sBjrSed4r+8-d2RGBVhbzaXxX+o=qqw2u-2jpF2RUqmEmA@mail.gmail.com>
From: Jeff Garzik <jgarzik@bitpay.com>
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2015 13:15:14 -0400
Message-ID: <CAJHLa0OJg2hC4Ab4Yxy3ekH4WXD9hqHore8+sbF9r1r2SwT_zg@mail.gmail.com>
To: Pieter Wuille <pieter.wuille@gmail.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113b0a0819505a0518919bc9
X-Spam-Score: -0.6 (/)
X-Spam-Report: Spam Filtering performed by mx.sourceforge.net.
	See http://spamassassin.org/tag/ for more details.
	-1.5 SPF_CHECK_PASS SPF reports sender host as permitted sender for
	sender-domain
	-0.0 SPF_PASS               SPF: sender matches SPF record
	1.0 HTML_MESSAGE           BODY: HTML included in message
	-0.1 DKIM_VALID_AU Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from
	author's domain
	0.1 DKIM_SIGNED            Message has a DKIM or DK signature,
	not necessarily valid
	-0.1 DKIM_VALID Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature
X-Headers-End: 1Z4Xz2-0005sp-Do
Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Scaling Bitcoin with Subchains
X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: <bitcoin-development.lists.sourceforge.net>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development>,
	<mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=bitcoin-development>
List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development>,
	<mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:15:44 -0000

--001a113b0a0819505a0518919bc9
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

On Mon, Jun 15, 2015 at 1:09 PM, Pieter Wuille <pieter.wuille@gmail.com>
wrote:

> It's simple: either you care about validation, and you must validate
> everything, or you don't, and you don't validate anything. Sidechains do
> not offer you a useful compromise here, as well as adding huge delays and
> conplexity.
>

As noted to Adam last night - although I agree it adds complexity - side
chains are one solution that will indeed help with scaling long term.
Similar to the graph you see with git repos and merges, having aggregation
chains that arbitrarily fork and then rejoin the main chain are both
feasible and useful.

That code & future is a ways away from production, so doesn't help us
here.  Still, let's not dismiss it as a solution either.

-- 
Jeff Garzik
Bitcoin core developer and open source evangelist
BitPay, Inc.      https://bitpay.com/

--001a113b0a0819505a0518919bc9
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">On Mon, Jun 15, 2015 at 1:09 PM, Pieter Wuille <span dir=
=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pieter.wuille@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">p=
ieter.wuille@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><div class=3D"gmail_extra">=
<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margi=
n:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><p dir=3D"ltr">It=
&#39;s simple: either you care about validation, and you must validate ever=
ything, or you don&#39;t, and you don&#39;t validate anything. Sidechains d=
o not offer you a useful compromise here, as well as adding huge delays and=
 conplexity.</p></blockquote></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br></div>As =
noted to Adam last night - although I agree it adds complexity - side chain=
s are one solution that will indeed help with scaling long term.=C2=A0 Simi=
lar to the graph you see with git repos and merges, having aggregation chai=
ns that arbitrarily fork and then rejoin the main chain are both feasible a=
nd useful.</div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_ex=
tra">That code &amp; future is a ways away from production, so doesn&#39;t =
help us here.=C2=A0 Still, let&#39;s not dismiss it as a solution either.<b=
r clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class=3D"gmail_signature">Jeff G=
arzik<br>Bitcoin core developer and open source evangelist<br>BitPay, Inc. =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0<a href=3D"https://bitpay.com/" target=3D"_blank">https=
://bitpay.com/</a></div>
</div></div>

--001a113b0a0819505a0518919bc9--