1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
129
130
131
132
133
134
135
136
137
138
139
140
141
142
143
144
145
146
147
148
149
150
151
152
153
154
155
156
157
158
159
160
161
|
Received: from sog-mx-2.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.192]
helo=mx.sourceforge.net)
by sfs-ml-1.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76)
(envelope-from <jgarzik@bitpay.com>) id 1Z4YiE-0002aC-AQ
for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net;
Mon, 15 Jun 2015 18:02:22 +0000
Received-SPF: pass (sog-mx-2.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com: domain of bitpay.com
designates 209.85.214.171 as permitted sender)
client-ip=209.85.214.171; envelope-from=jgarzik@bitpay.com;
helo=mail-ob0-f171.google.com;
Received: from mail-ob0-f171.google.com ([209.85.214.171])
by sog-mx-2.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128)
(Exim 4.76) id 1Z4YiD-00059g-9k
for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net;
Mon, 15 Jun 2015 18:02:22 +0000
Received: by obbgp2 with SMTP id gp2so69569448obb.2
for <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>;
Mon, 15 Jun 2015 11:02:15 -0700 (PDT)
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
d=1e100.net; s=20130820;
h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date
:message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type;
bh=/iKVzayJ+16dT07kVKCburFipbq7nlkQWdwdPRWrLmk=;
b=RREi2dFLDuZEvFm5U0lPAURqNtWTNI8TmtFQ0VH3BwOyt4rkesiMq+l09rMz2IN1nt
dW3xMpAOHVQvI0nqeChVpvEi8G8RNnXhNVyRWrSxion7rLZnWsF6u1b4emRJZlgIFpz8
DIz6zBOU7NW4d9uiNYDkGblhxILbcVk9yQ+nA2/IJQRolyADEAHBJ77vyHpIU1Noq29Q
ijT1vnJwWNfg8ZP8v8VGT4YaCscOwB+tdN9PIxPapZ0IkNkFrD9jKY4oBSp+4eor30cR
bAhBXDjP/1v6JguCQC3xu9xAAzjijoRYV6ti//H0+46kdsUpw5I232f9KPhB166j42H/
uxEQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQk2tbEMeHapW+JaTX28CVb2/HOR6/XFeI/4v+WGev6k41utBcWJcPeN1t3+qxnnk5IqNjjl
X-Received: by 10.182.87.36 with SMTP id u4mr1109808obz.50.1434391335845; Mon,
15 Jun 2015 11:02:15 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.202.108.149 with HTTP; Mon, 15 Jun 2015 11:01:55 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <CANEZrP1D0AN_iRobD2RYXHCCWhU7Vk6yZ35+ytsQ0zonSCG_HQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAL8tG==LG=xC_DzOaghbGGKab4=UVpGLQV7781pU4wg+WnFdMg@mail.gmail.com>
<CAPg+sBjqQ66f1Rmhi9HOBYP5BDjBHvTNPpUN-y3o-KX8dXBMhg@mail.gmail.com>
<557D2571.601@gmail.com>
<CAL8tG=kEv9AfQM+1Rv+tqBujFEjCp+BsjQ-1s7eJC-usogFFqw@mail.gmail.com>
<CAPg+sBjrSed4r+8-d2RGBVhbzaXxX+o=qqw2u-2jpF2RUqmEmA@mail.gmail.com>
<CANEZrP1D0AN_iRobD2RYXHCCWhU7Vk6yZ35+ytsQ0zonSCG_HQ@mail.gmail.com>
From: Jeff Garzik <jgarzik@bitpay.com>
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2015 14:01:55 -0400
Message-ID: <CAJHLa0PNbYST4R-5LJcVxmN=85bf0f3DLw5qgGmGQwvsExzseg@mail.gmail.com>
To: Mike Hearn <mike@plan99.net>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e013d0ddc0ad94a051892425b
X-Spam-Score: -0.6 (/)
X-Spam-Report: Spam Filtering performed by mx.sourceforge.net.
See http://spamassassin.org/tag/ for more details.
-1.5 SPF_CHECK_PASS SPF reports sender host as permitted sender for
sender-domain
-0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record
1.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message
-0.1 DKIM_VALID_AU Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from
author's domain
0.1 DKIM_SIGNED Message has a DKIM or DK signature,
not necessarily valid
-0.1 DKIM_VALID Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature
X-Headers-End: 1Z4YiD-00059g-9k
Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Scaling Bitcoin with Subchains
X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: <bitcoin-development.lists.sourceforge.net>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development>,
<mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=bitcoin-development>
List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development>,
<mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2015 18:02:22 -0000
--089e013d0ddc0ad94a051892425b
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Side chains are a way to scale and shard horizontally while still retaining
primary security parameters of the main chain.
The future is an Internet of chains, a forest of chains with bitcoin as the
root chain for: factom / proofofexistence, ChainDB, Blockstream side
chains, merge mined side chains, and more. A multi-chain design is much
more scalable in general.
On Mon, Jun 15, 2015 at 1:18 PM, Mike Hearn <mike@plan99.net> wrote:
> It's simple: either you care about validation, and you must validate
>> everything, or you don't, and you don't validate anything.
>>
> Pedantically: you could validate a random subset of all scripts, to give
> yourself probabilistic verification rather than full vs SPV. If enough
> people do it with a large enough subset the probability of a problem being
> detected goes up a lot. You still pay the cost of the database updates.
>
> But your main point is of course completely right, that side chains are
> not a way to scale up.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>
>
--
Jeff Garzik
Bitcoin core developer and open source evangelist
BitPay, Inc. https://bitpay.com/
--089e013d0ddc0ad94a051892425b
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<div dir=3D"ltr">Side chains are a way to scale and shard horizontally whil=
e still retaining primary security parameters of the main chain.<div><br></=
div><div>The future is an Internet of chains, a forest of chains with bitco=
in as the root chain for: factom / proofofexistence, ChainDB, Blockstream s=
ide chains, merge mined side chains, and more.=C2=A0 A multi-chain design i=
s much more scalable in general.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><b=
r></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On =
Mon, Jun 15, 2015 at 1:18 PM, Mike Hearn <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"m=
ailto:mike@plan99.net" target=3D"_blank">mike@plan99.net</a>></span> wro=
te:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-=
left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_=
extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><span class=3D""><blockquote class=3D"gma=
il_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-lef=
t:1ex"><p dir=3D"ltr">It's simple: either you care about validation, an=
d you must validate everything, or you don't, and you don't validat=
e anything.</p></blockquote></span><div>Pedantically: you could validate a =
random subset of all scripts, to give yourself probabilistic verification r=
ather than full vs SPV. If enough people do it with a large enough subset t=
he probability of a problem being detected goes up a lot. You still pay the=
cost of the database updates.</div><div><br></div><div>But your main point=
is of course completely right, that side chains are not a way to scale up.=
=C2=A0<br></div></div></div></div>
<br>-----------------------------------------------------------------------=
-------<br>
<br>_______________________________________________<br>
Bitcoin-development mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net">Bitcoin-develo=
pment@lists.sourceforge.net</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development=
" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/=
listinfo/bitcoin-development</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div cla=
ss=3D"gmail_signature">Jeff Garzik<br>Bitcoin core developer and open sourc=
e evangelist<br>BitPay, Inc. =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0<a href=3D"https://bitpay.=
com/" target=3D"_blank">https://bitpay.com/</a></div>
</div>
--089e013d0ddc0ad94a051892425b--
|
