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From: Danny Thorpe <danny.thorpe@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 09:15:45 -0700
Message-ID: <CAJN5wHW=ySsCxR237TAzXyqXf1VixsA2T7qCA8FCS12PPabU+Q@mail.gmail.com>
To: Moral Agent <ethan.scruples@gmail.com>, 
	Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
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Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Visually Differentiable - Bitcoin Addresses
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Humans are very visually oriented, recognizing differences in images more
easily than differences in text.

What about generating an image based on the bytes of an address, using
something like identicon, used by gravatar? Any small change to the text
input produces a significantly different image.

-Danny

On Oct 30, 2017 7:43 AM, "Moral Agent via bitcoin-dev" <
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:

> If you are going to rely on human verification of addresses, the best way
> might be map it to words.
>
> For example, with a 6000 word list, a 25 byte address (with a checksum)
> could be mapped to 16 words like this:
>
> vocally           acquire        removed     unfounded
> euphemism    sanctuary    sectional     driving
> entree            freckles    aloof           vertebrae
> scribble          surround      prelaw         effort
>
> In my opinion, that is much faster to verify than this:
>
> 13gQFTYHuAcfnZjXo2NFsy1E8JGSLwXHCZ
>
> or
>
> bc1qrp33g0q5c5txsp9arysrx4k6zdkfs4nce4xj0gdcccefvpysxf3qccfmv3
>
> Although I really do love Bech32.
>
> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 9:13 AM, shiva sitamraju via bitcoin-dev <
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>
>> For example bc1qeklep85ntjz4605drds6aww9u0qr46qzrv5xswd35uhjuj8ahfcqgf6hak
>> in 461e8a4aa0a0e75c06602c505bd7aa06e7116ba5cd98fd6e046e8cbeb00379d6 is
>> 62 bytes ! This is very very long. This will create lot of usability
>> problems in
>>
>> - Blockexplorers (atleast user should be visually able to compare in a
>> transaction having multiple outputs which one his address)
>> - Mobiles
>> - Payment terminals
>>
>> From my limited understanding, the purpose of inventing a bitcoin address
>> format is for usability and ease of identification (versus a ECDSA public
>> key), While I get the error/checksum capabilities Bech32 brings, any user
>> would prefer a 20 byte address with a checksum  over an address that would
>> wrap several lines !!
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:19 PM, Ben Thompson <
>> thompson.benedictjames@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Checking the first few bytes of a Bitcoin Address should not be
>>> considered sufficient for ensuring that it is correct as it takes less than
>>> a second to generate a 3 character vanity address that matches the first 3
>>> characters of an address.
>>>
>>> On Mon, 30 Oct 2017, 11:44 shiva sitamraju via bitcoin-dev, <
>>> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> When I copy and paste bitcoin address, I double check the first few
>>>> bytes, to make sure I copied the correct one. This is to make sure some
>>>> rogue software is not changing the address, or I incorrectly pasted the
>>>> wrong address.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> With Bech32 address, its seems like in this department we are taking as
>>>> step in the backward direction. With the traditional address, I could
>>>> compare first few bytes like 1Ko or 1L3. With bech32, bc1. is all I can see
>>>> and compare which is likely to be same anyway. Note that most users will
>>>> only compare the first few bytes only (since addresses themselves are very
>>>> long and will overflow in a mobile text box).
>>>>
>>>> Is there anyway to make the Bech32 addresses format more visually
>>>> distinct (atleast the first few bytes) ?
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> bitcoin-dev mailing list
>>>> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
>>>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> bitcoin-dev mailing list
>> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
>

--f403043be61c768379055cc5f38a
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<div dir=3D"auto">Humans are very visually oriented, recognizing difference=
s in images more easily than differences in text.<div dir=3D"auto"><br></di=
v><div dir=3D"auto">What about generating an image based on the bytes of an=
 address, using something like identicon, used by gravatar? Any small chang=
e to the text input produces a significantly different image.<div dir=3D"au=
to"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">-Danny</div></div></div><div class=3D"gmail=
_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Oct 30, 2017 7:43 AM, &quot;Moral=
 Agent via bitcoin-dev&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxf=
oundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br type=
=3D"attribution"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8=
ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">If you are=
 going to rely on human verification of addresses, the best way might be ma=
p it to words.<div><br></div><div>For example, with a 6000 word list, a 25 =
byte address (with a checksum) could be mapped to 16 words like this:<div><=
br></div><div><div>vocally =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 acquire =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0removed =C2=A0 =C2=A0 unfounded</div><div>euphemism=
 =C2=A0 =C2=A0sanctuary =C2=A0 =C2=A0sectional =C2=A0 =C2=A0 driving</div><=
div>entree =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0freckles <span style=3D=
"white-space:pre-wrap">	</span>=C2=A0 =C2=A0aloof =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 vertebrae</div><div>scribble =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0s=
urround =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0prelaw =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 effort</div>=
</div></div><div><br></div><div>In my opinion, that is much faster to verif=
y than this:</div><div><br></div><div>13gQFTYHuAcfnZjXo2NFsy1E8JGSLw<wbr>XH=
CZ<br></div><div><br></div><div>or</div><div><br></div><div>bc1qrp33g0q5c5t=
xsp9arysrx4k6zd<wbr>kfs4nce4xj0gdcccefvpysxf3qccfm<wbr>v3<br></div><div><br=
></div><div>Although I really do love Bech32.</div></div><div class=3D"gmai=
l_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 9:13 AM, sh=
iva sitamraju via bitcoin-dev <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bitco=
in-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank">bitcoin-dev@lists.<wbr>=
linuxfoundation.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quo=
te" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"=
><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div><div>For example bc1qeklep85ntjz4605drds6a=
ww9u0<wbr>qr46qzrv5xswd35uhjuj8ahfcqgf6h<wbr>ak in 461e8a4aa0a0e75c06602c50=
5bd7aa<wbr>06e7116ba5cd98fd6e046e8cbeb003<wbr>79d6 is 62 bytes ! This is ve=
ry very long. This will create lot of usability problems in <br></div><div>=
<br></div>- Blockexplorers (atleast user should be visually able to compare=
 in a transaction having multiple outputs which one his address)<br></div>-=
 Mobiles<br></div>- Payment terminals <br><br></div>From my limited underst=
anding, the purpose of inventing a bitcoin address format is for usability =
and ease of identification (versus a ECDSA public key), While I get the err=
or/checksum capabilities Bech32 brings, any user would prefer a 20 byte add=
ress with a checksum=C2=A0 over an address that would wrap several lines !!=
 <br><div><div><div><br></div></div></div></div><div class=3D"m_28589994469=
94048619HOEnZb"><div class=3D"m_2858999446994048619h5"><div class=3D"gmail_=
extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:19 PM, Ben =
Thompson <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:thompson.benedictjames@gma=
il.com" target=3D"_blank">thompson.benedictjames@gmail.<wbr>com</a>&gt;</sp=
an> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;=
border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Checking the =
first few bytes of a Bitcoin Address should not be considered sufficient fo=
r ensuring that it is correct as it takes less than a second to generate a =
3 character vanity address that matches the first 3 characters of an addres=
s.</div><span>
</span><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div><div class=3D"m_2858999446994048=
619m_-3543602302739662677h5"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Mon, 30 Oct 2017, 11:44 sh=
iva sitamraju via bitcoin-dev, &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linu=
xfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfounda<wbr>tion.o=
rg</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div></div></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" st=
yle=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div>=
<div class=3D"m_2858999446994048619m_-3543602302739662677h5"><div dir=3D"lt=
r"><div><div><div>Hi,<br><br></div>When I copy and paste bitcoin address, I=
 double check the first few bytes, to make sure I copied the correct one. T=
his is to make sure some rogue software is not changing the address, or I i=
ncorrectly pasted the wrong address.<br><br><br></div>With Bech32 address, =
its seems like in this department we are taking as step in the backward dir=
ection. With the traditional address, I could compare first few bytes like =
1Ko or 1L3. With bech32, bc1. is all I can see and compare which is likely =
to be same anyway. Note that most users will only compare the first few byt=
es only (since addresses themselves are very long and will overflow in a mo=
bile text box).<br><br></div>Is there anyway to make the Bech32 addresses f=
ormat more visually distinct (atleast the first few bytes) ? <br></div></di=
v></div><span>
______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
bitcoin-dev mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank">=
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundat<wbr>ion.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" =
rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundation.<wbr>org=
/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-d<wbr>ev</a><br>
</span></blockquote></div>
</blockquote></div><br></div>
</div></div><br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
bitcoin-dev mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank">=
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundat<wbr>ion.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" =
rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundation.<wbr>org=
/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-d<wbr>ev</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>
<br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
bitcoin-dev mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.=
<wbr>linuxfoundation.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" =
rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundation.<wbr>org=
/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-<wbr>dev</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div></div>

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