summaryrefslogtreecommitdiff
path: root/80/50ff3a83d486f99e17e5638ca2bdd1e57c460c
blob: 315893813f5c7a758e86f66047651568f2f5deac (plain)
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
129
130
131
132
133
134
135
136
137
138
139
140
141
142
143
144
145
146
147
148
149
150
151
152
153
154
155
156
157
158
159
160
161
162
163
164
165
166
167
168
169
170
171
172
173
174
175
176
Return-Path: <user@petertodd.org>
Received: from smtp3.osuosl.org (smtp3.osuosl.org [140.211.166.136])
 by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC32DC002D
 for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
 Tue, 28 Jun 2022 23:22:44 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])
 by smtp3.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5E5B60B60
 for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
 Tue, 28 Jun 2022 23:22:44 +0000 (UTC)
DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp3.osuosl.org B5E5B60B60
Authentication-Results: smtp3.osuosl.org;
 dkim=pass (2048-bit key, unprotected) header.d=petertodd.org
 header.i=@petertodd.org header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=fm3 header.b=osfl1YLM; 
 dkim=pass (2048-bit key,
 unprotected) header.d=messagingengine.com header.i=@messagingengine.com
 header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=fm2 header.b=uqdcR4x4
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.802
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.802 tagged_above=-999 required=5
 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1,
 DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7,
 SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001]
 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from smtp3.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1])
 by localhost (smtp3.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024)
 with ESMTP id 1qutEJm-x2xp
 for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
 Tue, 28 Jun 2022 23:22:43 +0000 (UTC)
X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0
DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp3.osuosl.org B67E0607F1
Received: from wout4-smtp.messagingengine.com (wout4-smtp.messagingengine.com
 [64.147.123.20])
 by smtp3.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B67E0607F1
 for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
 Tue, 28 Jun 2022 23:22:43 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from compute1.internal (compute1.nyi.internal [10.202.2.41])
 by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 971EA32003AC;
 Tue, 28 Jun 2022 19:22:42 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from mailfrontend2 ([10.202.2.163])
 by compute1.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 28 Jun 2022 19:22:42 -0400
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=petertodd.org;
 h=cc:cc:content-type:date:date:from:from:in-reply-to
 :in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references:reply-to:sender
 :subject:subject:to:to; s=fm3; t=1656458562; x=1656544962; bh=cf
 AilaFu9uFX6VqPexXnPh5LpOcbSUsvV40wcogBdZw=; b=osfl1YLMIAwAC5fCeh
 rGnscCaRM44p3H2gP3RFlztBkiiL2ONWZ3FNMsuvVeYPW9SQpQosbHRTNoEwEygs
 n+HdoyT/mhzOXWTY+ybDPR762ZSGzRPdjN8KoujjaRc2W+loic7Tkq+Kxzmkf61j
 CJQJsyRsHSiV/ashoErctg4a/IDl3+XoOAvp6DuQh6NcSdh6vffjC9JVJQDPqqmI
 NYJdc6GxG4cRSrqSvDPH20ZAD9XZIz2oPDX8wBF4Wwu4j0bUirdVwPQyAEYoJ4nJ
 a8gRiq0c6EQlQ580Kv7OKDizkvWHi8pmm9/OErGvnAS0tHYf/UzMyEZ4yDLZcXfj
 fdiA==
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=
 messagingengine.com; h=cc:cc:content-type:date:date:feedback-id
 :feedback-id:from:from:in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id
 :mime-version:references:reply-to:sender:subject:subject:to:to
 :x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=
 fm2; t=1656458562; x=1656544962; bh=cfAilaFu9uFX6VqPexXnPh5LpOcb
 SUsvV40wcogBdZw=; b=uqdcR4x4kV13b0T+gaedDK7Z2N1h2p8ZkatSeyoHeLay
 Vr+xXF779cFgHiIzvQIkH+KN/V+hvPdtTaLzqB3QdsA0TS9e1ln1gtzFRV46H7vb
 P/5i9/v5ug4hR4+vD5Ssh9zeovyPmrG+Qwq94oYm8sqiNEXrGG7ogJbNmNW/dgnW
 XWiqei5aq7w+2ZJniYpooNWqvmjlZREllwjLzNydrbk6Fj06vBBuS4C6pLlNOTR+
 YpGDgEGbzAHgbVcyTeHjZOCVOSYQzkTAE3kKCdF37Y9+vjQJBTOywrRK9uVRDvn9
 jmTQHBXUeKzCojQrxKDrLvYgZ4s1t24CdWVSSzhU+w==
X-ME-Sender: <xms:Qo27Yjy9gxeSRG2L43h6A58b3GuXla8Ljm9OcXlnrFCpMccqjQDz5w>
 <xme:Qo27YrSWYSLPPerJyyBVuZDpp9FET9YUfHvA4qRoxsYvZozaUq7zWzS8anLhsnl0E
 pjogGVIIHIPjQQd1vE>
X-ME-Received: <xmr:Qo27YtU6Q06mvo-r9wb7qgWl9SUhd96FHnI-KMxNYBQY5vu2ZwTBdsT3f1OeLokY3z5P_afprtJWaXJWqcqrPQ>
X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvfedrudegkedgudelucetufdoteggodetrfdotf
 fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen
 uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpihgvnhhtshculddquddttddmne
 cujfgurhepfffhvfevuffkfhggtggujgesghdtreertddtvdenucfhrhhomheprfgvthgv
 rhcuvfhougguuceophgvthgvsehpvghtvghrthhouggurdhorhhgqeenucggtffrrghtth
 gvrhhnpeelvdellefftddukeduffejgfefjeeuheeileeftdfgteduteeggeevueethfej
 tdenucffohhmrghinhepphgvthgvrhhtohguugdrohhrghenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiii
 gvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehushgvrhesphgvthgvrhhtohguugdr
 ohhrgh
X-ME-Proxy: <xmx:Qo27YtjWuvD3_c4RemtW67IC4iiWfzubXB3uCAjc1YL1j4_Z_BEwhw>
 <xmx:Qo27YlBO9_drHU6eOovmF7h7kfiDaNwJVAp1REQ546gBz6efWfSQsw>
 <xmx:Qo27YmLUTtdkc6p8l8duL9g7XoSniIxOspACvUmjVoA7UQFoLzBOoA>
 <xmx:Qo27Yi7lFGSZM_mJMmgYJcRPzaiH5zd8uXK0dey-MZocJ1ed2Ek-Yw>
Feedback-ID: i525146e8:Fastmail
Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA; Tue,
 28 Jun 2022 19:22:41 -0400 (EDT)
Received: by localhost (Postfix, from userid 1000)
 id 94B705F908; Tue, 28 Jun 2022 19:22:40 -0400 (EDT)
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2022 19:22:40 -0400
From: Peter Todd <pete@petertodd.org>
To: Alex Lee <cloudstrife79@gmail.com>,
 Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Message-ID: <YruNQNKDn1octvkj@petertodd.org>
References: <CAJowKgJ8GP4Ykzn5dMHZ7wsE04YmpOLgTpdc9tgfVng0qB0Jjg@mail.gmail.com>
 <YqVfTU0M7XN8+Ybu@petertodd.org>
 <Pwr9EFLSv2rU7nXRzqFuw2LPxpFo22g_qYy4reQzpMuSlgRzTG536uLjZCc9sI43olReGMA7BFgjnxJGKtZNtxU7qRy_-YYOnz6TeMy4h8Q=@protonmail.com>
 <Yq77CnxOhr615ip8@petertodd.org>
 <CAAxiura7-TTUOg=vuH8q+orX+LVED74f+NvaYqVve3j--CjTMQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJowKgL=nVwnUrpSKmnsTxOfk3DEEZL7awG=HypyCXSR3XCLxg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CALeFGL0CQC4_swZTt-=sbe=ZiCmRthZghGDtrWFx5bQCBeOJcg@mail.gmail.com>
 <YrS8URqD/BW4UrP0@petertodd.org>
 <CAGpPWDb=dF4-D5GKb2NoEcdW6TokNQyrwpGVwHJk+0HL43+J1Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAPNW7nVjRgBHJritW5UECk7SiNTO+BWaHEGwKULh9o4=w=2yhw@mail.gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512;
 protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="fvn11mazM/kTLpiD"
Content-Disposition: inline
In-Reply-To: <CAPNW7nVjRgBHJritW5UECk7SiNTO+BWaHEGwKULh9o4=w=2yhw@mail.gmail.com>
Cc: Billy Tetrud <billy.tetrud@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Bitcoin covenants are inevitable
X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>, 
 <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/>
List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>, 
 <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2022 23:22:45 -0000


--fvn11mazM/kTLpiD
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Disposition: inline
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

On Tue, Jun 28, 2022 at 12:23:40PM -0400, Alex Lee via bitcoin-dev wrote:
> > > Those who never transact, never realize any benefit.
> >
> > While that's true, its not relevant and basically a red herring. You ne=
ed
> > to compare those who transact often and rarely hold, to those who hold a
> > lot but rarely transact. Its not helpful to consider those who throw th=
eir
> > bitcoin into a bottomless pit and never retrieve them.
> >
>=20
> There are legitimate uses for burning bitcoin, speaking of bottomless pit=
s.
> I would avoid confusing velocity metrics with utility, as these aren't the
> same thing.

All the legitimate uses for burning bitcoin are _not_ done via a "bottomless
pit": they're done with transactions proving that the bitcoin has actually =
been
burnt.  And the value obtained by burning BTC in those scenarios is affecte=
d by
tx fees and inflation just as much as any other tx.

--=20
https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org

--fvn11mazM/kTLpiD
Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc"

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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=h4EP
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

--fvn11mazM/kTLpiD--