summaryrefslogtreecommitdiff
path: root/70/ede4bf26c018db6967b020a5eabc9ec0cfbfac
blob: 779278d1f832c51b9aa2ca881aa3d7d11ba08be8 (plain)
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
Return-Path: <ZmnSCPxj@protonmail.com>
Received: from smtp2.osuosl.org (smtp2.osuosl.org [140.211.166.133])
 by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A55ABC0012
 for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
 Sat, 18 Dec 2021 01:00:30 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])
 by smtp2.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EE9840645
 for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
 Sat, 18 Dec 2021 01:00:30 +0000 (UTC)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.599
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5
 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1,
 DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001,
 FROM_LOCAL_NOVOWEL=0.5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001,
 RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001]
 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: smtp2.osuosl.org (amavisd-new);
 dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=protonmail.com
Received: from smtp2.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1])
 by localhost (smtp2.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024)
 with ESMTP id vGn8IIw5WyXj
 for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
 Sat, 18 Dec 2021 01:00:29 +0000 (UTC)
X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0
Received: from mail-40130.protonmail.ch (mail-40130.protonmail.ch
 [185.70.40.130])
 by smtp2.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EE29640010
 for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
 Sat, 18 Dec 2021 01:00:28 +0000 (UTC)
Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2021 01:00:14 +0000
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=protonmail.com;
 s=protonmail2; t=1639789225;
 bh=Q4IUo5dEMtlzyDnNXr9kHvhpw88vo3uiHAdGI9wvBf8=;
 h=Date:To:From:Reply-To:Subject:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:
 From:To:Cc;
 b=J9v4kjUqxFfaVXBeHCrN9SS5iKy8epOSrcrOr/CRWNXiXyxymTSbgunxHvWbDuBZl
 65cIVz1xXs/hU5GNTdcaeOeuPnjTF3BIsaafxXF+4TW3fO+Mv1Q0Sd9qQaIuszLt/o
 mAizSIFeNBaAj5SIVeOJzxBGPvyaCrfbelCdyRf4loFZJw5dVY5pReouWuCDN7Actt
 S45+3YkIDzfIF03SwDNu3q+QBOCjvL4KfRKPr0P9b5BF8SzscelM3oZA351+HQmUEd
 9MBnwmifyZDZA0OIQQ9epryE74bgchD34DN6Kz+Ylq0CgYgnjomgP470IzGAj4E0eN
 JhMK0TwGOj77g==
To: Jeremy <jlrubin@mit.edu>,
 Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
From: ZmnSCPxj <ZmnSCPxj@protonmail.com>
Reply-To: ZmnSCPxj <ZmnSCPxj@protonmail.com>
Message-ID: <BPaAFvgTqtCsxcAr1W_jlvWkHOaRi41GCfdHsblFGmqBVKR20qC18xk89Wh28Cmaf2YGUlN_N9_g9S_ij3bZbhsD_0qaDMcvqV1GdScVoTs=@protonmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAD5xwhjDBD38Xt=p=AW7XU3OCh0_9nb=-7neXuLcd-VAXJBE-Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD5xwhjDBD38Xt=p=AW7XU3OCh0_9nb=-7neXuLcd-VAXJBE-Q@mail.gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Bitcoin Advent Calendar] Oracles, Bonds,
	and Attestation Chains
X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>, 
 <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/>
List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>, 
 <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2021 01:00:30 -0000

Good morning Jeremy,

> Today's post is pretty cool: it details how covenants like CTV can be use=
d to improve on-chain bitcoin signing oracles by solving the timeout/rollov=
er issue and solving the miner/oracle collusion issue on punishment. This i=
ssue is similar to the Blockstream Liquid Custody Federation rollover bug f=
rom a while back (which this type of design also helps to fix).
>
> https://rubin.io/bitcoin/2021/12/17/advent-20/
>
> It also describes:
> - how a protocol on top can make 'branch free' attestation chains where i=
f you equivocate your funds get burned.
> - lightly, various uses for these chained attestations
>
> In addition, Robin Linus has a great whitepaper he put out getting much m=
ore in the weeds on the concepts described in the post, it's linked in the =
first bit of the post.

Nice, bonds are significantly better if you can ensure that the bonder cann=
ot recover their funds.
Without a covenant the best you could do would be to have the bonder risk l=
oss of funds on equivocation, not have the bonder actually definitely lose =
funds.

We should note that "equivocate" is not "lie".
An oracle can still lie, it just needs to consistently lie (i.e. not equivo=
cate).

As an example, if the oracle is a signer for a federated sidechain, it coul=
d still sign an invalid sidechain block that inflates the sidecoin supply.
It is simply prevented from later denying this by signing an alternative va=
lid sidechain block and acting as if it never signed the invalid sidechain =
block.
But if it sticks to its guns, then the sidechain simply stops operation wit=
h everyone owning sidecoins losing their funds (and if the oracle already e=
xited the sidechain, its bond remains safe, as it did not equivocate, it on=
ly lied).

Regards,
ZmnSCPxj