1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
|
Received: from sog-mx-1.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.191]
helo=mx.sourceforge.net)
by sfs-ml-1.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76)
(envelope-from <adam@cypherspace.org>) id 1WaNfz-0005FN-3n
for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net;
Wed, 16 Apr 2014 11:06:47 +0000
X-ACL-Warn:
Received: from mout.perfora.net ([74.208.4.194])
by sog-mx-1.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128)
(Exim 4.76) id 1WaNfx-0008Uk-Pc
for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net;
Wed, 16 Apr 2014 11:06:47 +0000
Received: from netbook (c107-70.i07-27.onvol.net [92.251.107.70])
by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrus4) with ESMTP (Nemesis)
id 0Lfkck-1XK9w21q82-00obuH; Wed, 16 Apr 2014 07:06:37 -0400
Received: by netbook (Postfix, from userid 1000)
id C06492E04CC; Wed, 16 Apr 2014 13:06:29 +0200 (CEST)
Received: by flare (hashcash-sendmail, from uid 1000);
Wed, 16 Apr 2014 13:06:27 +0200
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2014 13:06:27 +0200
From: Adam Back <adam@cypherspace.org>
To: Wladimir <laanwj@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20140416110627.GA8131@netbook.cypherspace.org>
References: <CA+s+GJDdENtqQt1f+L5htuuyPxUxsq0prLQFBLirTjJz0nG1gw@mail.gmail.com>
<CAKaEYhKDDCSOiygnfsMpO-dQKjwHnm0icoH9+oGqo+114_9sAQ@mail.gmail.com>
<CA+s+GJB6aThjpMOUodK2Uc-jw=x6rSuRyX5gqsS+mK=DxJ7N5g@mail.gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
Content-Disposition: inline
In-Reply-To: <CA+s+GJB6aThjpMOUodK2Uc-jw=x6rSuRyX5gqsS+mK=DxJ7N5g@mail.gmail.com>
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15)
X-Hashcash: 1:20:140416:laanwj@gmail.com::xIVfMufQ1h5+S5NA:07oDk
X-Hashcash: 1:20:140416:melvincarvalho@gmail.com::S95gjtXomBriggGo:0000000000000
00000000000000000000000027Fu
X-Hashcash: 1:20:140416:bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net::yQJTj1CfZcKto
g5D:000000000000000000000W0f
X-Hashcash: 1:20:140416:adam@cypherspace.org::Lj81i4vIfZVXGSTU:00000000000000000
0000000000000000000000002dFk
X-Provags-ID: V02:K0:M9g9UAKZdrh0VcDJ6lwCMA1OV9e7loQmDVzxCkxCqZV
lRz8q+Ae8zUQP2fVv+JxUk1E20GyVpbapM3O2Dw1OsHFhDNkau
9pTjzVB8i6mFJrPpkpze/uI9jL30CkMrsKC2Q6tr7kdrPSie8m
SWgyF1cmA6AkApGvMzH5KBOpcxGkpaHkV+u01pDriIg3F8dxLH
ib3MS6ZTZULKTQAYM3YO1Yajx324kqNTrwveSWnAEUInikfs7t
PwknkN6VbLiXbZ4uJl/AdgZ08khlCBplPkP5rYhJR/nmG2NueD
pJVO6VjRTci/lpoDXrEWPa5YBwGjtprDxCR7nzYFgWChy8wkxK
DHdoyqHbUIjfiPhrI0dugro2trrJtPbHn/x5jKRp/
X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/)
X-Spam-Report: Spam Filtering performed by mx.sourceforge.net.
See http://spamassassin.org/tag/ for more details.
-0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/,
no trust [74.208.4.194 listed in list.dnswl.org]
-0.0 SPF_HELO_PASS SPF: HELO matches SPF record
X-Headers-End: 1WaNfx-0008Uk-Pc
Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
Subject: [Bitcoin-development] mid-term bitcoin security (Re: Warning
message when running wallet in Windows XP (or drop support?))
X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: <bitcoin-development.lists.sourceforge.net>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development>,
<mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=bitcoin-development>
List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development>,
<mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2014 11:06:47 -0000
Big picture/mid-term I think air-gaps and zero-trust ecosystem components
are the only solution. (zero-trust meaning like real-time auditability, or
type 2/type 3 exchanges based on atomic-swap, trustless escrow etc).
Need a mass-production and air-drop of trezors :)
There is one more problem address-substitution via untrusted network/user
and weak site with 1mil lines of swiss-cheese security app-store. So some
kind of address authentication TOFU. Aside from X509 bloatware which could
be extended from payment protocol to do that, I'd argue for a native simple
TOFU format like Alan Reiner's multiplier * base approach (where base is the
TOFU handle). And/or something like the IBE address proposal (which gives a
bandwidth efficiently SPV queryable way to check if funds received). Worst
case if weil-pairing gets broken it auto-devolves to the current status
quo.
Btw not to reignite the stealth vs reusable address bike shedding, but
contrarily I was thinking it maybe actually better to try to rebrand address
as "invoice number". People understand double paying an invoice is not a
good idea. And if they receive the same invoice twice they'll query it.
Adam
On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 11:41:48AM +0200, Wladimir wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 10:45 AM, Melvin Carvalho
> <[1]melvincarvalho@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> XP with a trezor would work fine tho?
>
> Probably - but that's a very rare edge case. People that are security
> conscious enough to buy a Trezor will not run XP. Also I don't dare to
> say that there is not some way to sociaal-engineer the user with
> malware on a compromised OS even with a trezor.
> Maybe: for 0.9.2 add a warning message and push people to upgrade
> (either to Win8.1 or something else), then in the next major release
> 0.10.0 drop XP support completely.
> Wladimir
>
>References
>
> 1. mailto:melvincarvalho@gmail.com
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book
>"Graph Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and their
>applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the field,
>this first edition is now available. Download your free book today!
>http://p.sf.net/sfu/NeoTech
>_______________________________________________
>Bitcoin-development mailing list
>Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
|
