1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
129
130
131
132
133
134
135
136
137
138
139
140
141
142
143
144
145
146
147
148
149
150
151
152
153
154
155
156
157
158
159
160
161
162
163
164
165
166
167
168
169
170
171
172
173
174
175
176
177
178
179
180
181
182
183
184
185
186
187
|
Received: from sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.193]
helo=mx.sourceforge.net)
by sfs-ml-1.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76)
(envelope-from <pieter.wuille@gmail.com>) id 1VZQVj-0003Ee-Db
for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net;
Thu, 24 Oct 2013 19:23:59 +0000
Received-SPF: pass (sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com: domain of gmail.com
designates 209.85.223.171 as permitted sender)
client-ip=209.85.223.171; envelope-from=pieter.wuille@gmail.com;
helo=mail-ie0-f171.google.com;
Received: from mail-ie0-f171.google.com ([209.85.223.171])
by sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128)
(Exim 4.76) id 1VZQVh-0001zT-Ff
for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net;
Thu, 24 Oct 2013 19:23:59 +0000
Received: by mail-ie0-f171.google.com with SMTP id tp5so4862201ieb.30
for <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>;
Thu, 24 Oct 2013 12:23:52 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Received: by 10.50.170.225 with SMTP id ap1mr2920429igc.47.1382642632008;
Thu, 24 Oct 2013 12:23:52 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.50.141.136 with HTTP; Thu, 24 Oct 2013 12:23:51 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <CAJna-HiE8YgKOuAHubRKbJYQviMz8Ws9E+eMDwcgV1pWpDBijg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJna-HgXPNa2UCO_edBzK=oY5-F=6LQVHap1Vk9XtGr09chy9Q@mail.gmail.com>
<796AC330-56EF-43D2-9935-5409824A4F33@godofgod.co.uk>
<CAJna-HhKDx4xnwWCC7apTLCDwEurFbagNTYXF=doBbhDBaXojA@mail.gmail.com>
<0F445FFE-FA1A-4A64-9A28-C734E744B5F7@godofgod.co.uk>
<5231AF5E.8080903@gk2.sk>
<15F27A88-53BF-4149-A8FF-282350312B92@godofgod.co.uk>
<CAJna-HiE8YgKOuAHubRKbJYQviMz8Ws9E+eMDwcgV1pWpDBijg@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2013 21:23:51 +0200
Message-ID: <CAPg+sBjFAJrDx=dzU3nWCiaUBEiD5fZ2B1aMHGgT1gE402N0Kg@mail.gmail.com>
From: Pieter Wuille <pieter.wuille@gmail.com>
To: slush <slush@centrum.cz>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Spam-Score: -1.6 (-)
X-Spam-Report: Spam Filtering performed by mx.sourceforge.net.
See http://spamassassin.org/tag/ for more details.
0.0 URIBL_BLOCKED ADMINISTRATOR NOTICE: The query to URIBL was blocked.
See
http://wiki.apache.org/spamassassin/DnsBlocklists#dnsbl-block
for more information. [URIs: github.com]
-1.5 SPF_CHECK_PASS SPF reports sender host as permitted sender for
sender-domain
0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider
(pieter.wuille[at]gmail.com)
-0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record
-0.1 DKIM_VALID_AU Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from
author's domain
0.1 DKIM_SIGNED Message has a DKIM or DK signature,
not necessarily valid
-0.1 DKIM_VALID Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature
X-Headers-End: 1VZQVh-0001zT-Ff
Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] BIP0039 Mnemonic code for generating
deterministic keys
X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: <bitcoin-development.lists.sourceforge.net>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development>,
<mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=bitcoin-development>
List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development>,
<mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2013 19:23:59 -0000
This is probably too late in the discussion, and I certainly don't
want to derail any standard being formed. But if it is controversial,
I want to offer my own suggestion.
This is a proposal I wrote a year ago, but never spent enough work to
push it as a standard:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=102349.0
It needs some work, but I believe it may be a base for a superior
system than what is being proposed here. As the scheme linked above
has built-in configurable difficulty and checksums, the word set being
used doesn't need to function for checking anymore. You could use any
dictionary/language/text generator, and feed it into the system - the
software on the other side doesn't need to use the same dictionary.
The disadvantage is of course that it cannot encode arbitrary data -
it can only be used to generate a random seed. It does have some
theoretical advantages, though (see link).
--
Pieter
On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 8:26 PM, slush <slush@centrum.cz> wrote:
> We've reflected many comments about BIP39 wordlist from the community and I
> think the wordlist is much better now. Specifically we removed many of
> theoretically offensive words as well as we implemented algorithm for
> detecting words with similar characters (cat/eat) and we resolved these
> duplicities. I'm now quite happy with the wordlist and I want to ask you for
> next (final?) round of comments.
>
> From other features, we added password protection of seed and seed hardening
> (against bruteforcing) using Rijndael cipher. This has been chosen because
> its blocksize can be 128, 192 or 256 bits, so it fits length of desired
> seeds. Also there are Rijndael implementations in every language. Btw
> password protection has one interesting feature - plausible deniability. It
> allows user to have one mnemonic and by using it with different passwords,
> it will generate different BIP32 wallets.... (wink wink)
>
> I want to be pretty clear that we need to close this topic somehow, because
> we want to use such algorithm in Trezor (which deadline is coming quick) and
> also other wallet developers want to implement such algorithm into clients
> to be compatible with Trezor. There were quite strict requirements for such
> algorithm (like the possibility to convert mnemonic to seed as well as seed
> to mnemonic) and I think we found a good solution. I'm wildly asking you for
> constructive comments, but saying "it's a crap, I don't like it" won't help
> anything.
>
> Thanks,
> slush
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 12, 2013 at 6:02 PM, Matthew Mitchell
> <matthewmitchell@godofgod.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> I removed some more but I haven't added enough back in. It was taking far
>> longer than expected so I gave up, but maybe someone else can try to add
>> some more:
>>
>>
>> https://github.com/MatthewLM/python-mnemonic/blob/master/mnemonic/wordlist/english.txt
>>
>> On 12 Sep 2013, at 13:11, Pavol Rusnak <stick@gk2.sk> wrote:
>>
>> > On 10/09/13 23:03, Matthew Mitchell wrote:
>> >> Maybe it would have been better without the aggressive words?
>> >
>> > I revisited the wordlist and replaced around 67 words that can be
>> > found offensive in some context.
>> >
>> > --
>> > Best Regards / S pozdravom,
>> >
>> > Pavol Rusnak <stick@gk2.sk>
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > How ServiceNow helps IT people transform IT departments:
>> > 1. Consolidate legacy IT systems to a single system of record for IT
>> > 2. Standardize and globalize service processes across IT
>> > 3. Implement zero-touch automation to replace manual, redundant tasks
>> >
>> > http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=51271111&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Bitcoin-development mailing list
>> > Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> How ServiceNow helps IT people transform IT departments:
>> 1. Consolidate legacy IT systems to a single system of record for IT
>> 2. Standardize and globalize service processes across IT
>> 3. Implement zero-touch automation to replace manual, redundant tasks
>>
>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=51271111&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>> _______________________________________________
>> Bitcoin-development mailing list
>> Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> October Webinars: Code for Performance
> Free Intel webinars can help you accelerate application performance.
> Explore tips for MPI, OpenMP, advanced profiling, and more. Get the most
> from
> the latest Intel processors and coprocessors. See abstracts and register >
> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=60135991&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>
|