1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
129
130
131
132
133
134
135
136
137
138
139
140
141
142
143
144
145
146
147
148
149
150
151
152
153
154
155
156
157
158
159
160
161
162
163
164
165
166
167
168
169
170
171
172
173
174
175
176
177
178
179
180
181
182
|
Return-Path: <user@petertodd.org>
Received: from smtp1.osuosl.org (smtp1.osuosl.org [IPv6:2605:bc80:3010::138])
by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34FF9C002D
for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
Thu, 23 Jun 2022 19:13:59 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])
by smtp1.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C717E84722
for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
Thu, 23 Jun 2022 19:13:58 +0000 (UTC)
DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp1.osuosl.org C717E84722
Authentication-Results: smtp1.osuosl.org;
dkim=pass (2048-bit key, unprotected) header.d=petertodd.org
header.i=@petertodd.org header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=fm3 header.b=EtBnIE59;
dkim=pass (2048-bit key,
unprotected) header.d=messagingengine.com header.i=@messagingengine.com
header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=fm2 header.b=PqfiAVwG
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.802
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.802 tagged_above=-999 required=5
tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1,
DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7,
SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001]
autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from smtp1.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1])
by localhost (smtp1.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024)
with ESMTP id lLShZSYCyhaY
for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
Thu, 23 Jun 2022 19:13:58 +0000 (UTC)
X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0
DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp1.osuosl.org 727B5845B4
Received: from wout4-smtp.messagingengine.com (wout4-smtp.messagingengine.com
[64.147.123.20])
by smtp1.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 727B5845B4
for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
Thu, 23 Jun 2022 19:13:57 +0000 (UTC)
Received: from compute4.internal (compute4.nyi.internal [10.202.2.44])
by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6852132000D7;
Thu, 23 Jun 2022 15:13:51 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from mailfrontend2 ([10.202.2.163])
by compute4.internal (MEProxy); Thu, 23 Jun 2022 15:13:51 -0400
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=petertodd.org;
h=cc:cc:content-type:date:date:from:from:in-reply-to
:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references:reply-to:sender
:subject:subject:to:to; s=fm3; t=1656011630; x=1656098030; bh=Kj
q07Nv4SOhv6ggCI5EAktCfyKutgZC+TAHiaT/+914=; b=EtBnIE599QfVAv0MeF
przR7dU9TxAbPJS6T2EXinaGP+jwugXu6c0KgDKCGiBuollB0n/rNLChRybArQ+H
/c6EpQCTntmoOkzNSixYxaC6rGJMvsgYZHPDnoYOcnKFMF7mFEpnLeaxeBSISs4X
t/EBfVA2z4BoBa8rN6KRWRi1YHcV5EnlYTwe3m/WIku2RbWLvu2rGpNpqu7CBnNe
K4S8KDSLtcS5oJqBeWCMyHBZZbyiU/KbckwQ6B7PcCrLSjwzwAeUMiVX/hbLUDkU
gDwKsuHK+qbx0PWctKBHZLUWChfG8un0UQ8vFwBfFGQpjZ5VWD4aYmgOC0h/4FW7
HIdw==
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=
messagingengine.com; h=cc:cc:content-type:date:date:feedback-id
:feedback-id:from:from:in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id
:mime-version:references:reply-to:sender:subject:subject:to:to
:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=
fm2; t=1656011630; x=1656098030; bh=Kjq07Nv4SOhv6ggCI5EAktCfyKut
gZC+TAHiaT/+914=; b=PqfiAVwGHtleWnBKoPYMxq1PwJ+O+V2r5FYG62iirkIH
4Gvzj1gg+OdGRZUxfdveH+36OSMaCdQJCl3m90j+AOzukLUL6YF3TnvwtTS3LTo0
NCniKeV8/xJoKRh+lTZoUrQgg77T+llV2IF5RhKXuHpHqPawe6kf/Q7+9UrPp7Uu
EZ6gKp/qQ2kygFBc5mT7siON0aHcH14ra9DU8Opugp2m3mtTXf2F0m2FVwZ2Vr39
LLLDoAtwBE0dNKndZDfXLHWszB+R04XRGbZAFcxMMm+0j2mtRgIgKTm7IfefSYoD
HDvE+dGISgBEEcvd3GKvS6RbbXZZPcjFErQOsEWseg==
X-ME-Sender: <xms:bru0Yq47Ty2uyauE_0H_BcKhbhzC3tp5uHf2PHmSWrspIsNothywJA>
<xme:bru0Yj7ZuKpGeEFc5Xn8csdXZr3RnoKv8SHqmNnCS63nk565BVgTUgTR4XdFdU8Wc
EAWB1RU-i5eEJxZus8>
X-ME-Received: <xmr:bru0YpeLasQntfCART4gq0evk2g7f-Dsztx4vsPB4pvqmAFBSVJEoJSpsRO5o2wvD3Ec2JJxE3Gp53l61DClTaVj9z3w>
X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvfedrudefjedgudefhecutefuodetggdotefrod
ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfgh
necuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmd
enucfjughrpeffhffvvefukfhfgggtuggjsehgtderredttddvnecuhfhrohhmpefrvght
vghrucfvohguugcuoehpvghtvgesphgvthgvrhhtohguugdrohhrgheqnecuggftrfgrth
htvghrnhepgfevkedtteevkeejgedufeehvdejteffffeuueeugfetveefieelgefhteei
ueetnecuffhomhgrihhnpehophgvnhhtihhmvghsthgrmhhpshdrohhrghdpphgvthgvrh
htohguugdrohhrghenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhl
fhhrohhmpehushgvrhesphgvthgvrhhtohguugdrohhrgh
X-ME-Proxy: <xmx:bru0YnKF3kDhtq-oP1qdVRSAdsKPllXzTBEOVmns_muhO04UnJuljQ>
<xmx:bru0YuIB_6cM_IHGV62bf_6Nu6b01cw9WYY09qyBxhpVM8i55tpLjw>
<xmx:bru0Yox1g9z3-05Xiu17ZiVexQra8wK5qQkqzP2-SUTqXYgqd6k3gQ>
<xmx:bru0YozkjpySEG5PqNwfn8LCaR0lHZT6brQwAL7oLHK_vw18krQqzA>
Feedback-ID: i525146e8:Fastmail
Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA; Thu,
23 Jun 2022 15:13:50 -0400 (EDT)
Received: by localhost (Postfix, from userid 1000)
id C5C9222B56; Thu, 23 Jun 2022 15:13:47 -0400 (EDT)
Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2022 15:13:47 -0400
From: Peter Todd <pete@petertodd.org>
To: Antoine Riard <antoine.riard@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <YrS7a0E7xLswLD92@petertodd.org>
References: <CALZpt+GOh-7weEypT9JrzcwthZJqHOfj7sf9FMuqi5_FZv0g7w@mail.gmail.com>
<YrEHo+3XLDNgIOnz@petertodd.org>
<CALZpt+EL=k_6iE5B950oz3EdLaQbRvgCNYZ8Lko4fcONcACvfw@mail.gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512;
protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="cXOSnUuvuZ5Dhv6I"
Content-Disposition: inline
In-Reply-To: <CALZpt+EL=k_6iE5B950oz3EdLaQbRvgCNYZ8Lko4fcONcACvfw@mail.gmail.com>
Cc: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Playing with full-rbf peers for fun and L2s
security
X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>,
<mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/>
List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>,
<mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2022 19:13:59 -0000
--cXOSnUuvuZ5Dhv6I
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Disposition: inline
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Tue, Jun 21, 2022 at 07:45:48PM -0400, Antoine Riard wrote:
> > BTW I changed one of my OTS calendars to issue fee-bumping txs without =
the
> > opt-in RBF flag set as an experiment. I also made sure txs would
> propagate to
> > the above node. As of right now, it's up to 32 replacements (once per
> block),
> > without any of them mined; the calendars use the strategy of starting at
> the
> > minimum possible fee, and bumping the fee up every time a new block
> arrives
> > without the tx getting mined. So that's evidence we don't have much
> full-rbf
> > hash power at this moment.
> >
> > You can see the current status at:
> https://alice.btc.calendar.opentimestamps.org/
>=20
> That's interesting. I'm not sure if we can conclude of the absence of
> full-rbf hash power at this moment, as it could also be a lack of full-rbf
> propagation path towards such potential hash power. I think the day we see
> an opt-out replacement transaction mined, it would constitute a good hint
> of full-rbf hash power (assuming the tx-relay topology stays relatively
> stable across the transaction issuance...)
Fees are relatively low right now, so there could be 1% or so of full-rbf h=
ash
power and I wouldn't notice with this particular technique as the initial tx
gets mined within 10-20 blocks; a few years back similar experiments were
finding a few percentage points of hashing power running full-rbf.
> Anyway, if/when the `fullrbf` patch lands in Bitcoin Core, including
> automatic outbound connections to few `NODE_REPLACE_BY_FEE` peers, I'm
> thinking of reaching out to a few mining node operators to advocate them
> with the new policy setting.
I'd suggest doing that right now, without waiting for the patch to get merg=
ed,
as it improves the politics of getting the patch merged. Miners tend to run
customized bitcoind's anyway.
--=20
https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org
--cXOSnUuvuZ5Dhv6I
Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc"
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEFcyURjhyM68BBPYTJIFAPaXwkfsFAmK0u2cACgkQJIFAPaXw
kftZVQf/eestR6ixVBzFqTWEobrwwfT8S1t3ttLhAk0kiQFstfKicgsJ3vcU8RQ6
nVRt0T3KW9rz8fxNORg9We6gkMOOERSxoItl/+C8DPTrhJRdWgmzXLFddn6Knd+g
+djMgzmRmwGW87xtB1vnHxoqC8sJoONPsjKmDjS/kvAjilB5pijWqltWr825/I8r
bG1EyDcBBi0dz4nM16dOgbBHwVOwQCWm8ft73yBoyKAOmnzai5oh1y8cVLSHQAcv
wt58C378VMROLPufzriJgXIeO8e8lS4m1tI7PEL0o5BI6UmbmScgF4/3ZEhKKjXB
OLSKS8XcrcToLcCBXLrJGBuHekNGEw==
=0UtU
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
--cXOSnUuvuZ5Dhv6I--
|