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Date: Sun, 2 Aug 2015 23:33:31 -0500
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From: Jim Phillips <jim@ergophobia.org>
To: Pindar Wong <pindar.wong@gmail.com>
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Cc: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] A reason we can all agree on to increase block
size
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--e89a8f235739029381051c60ac66
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I realize that my argument may have come across as anti-Chinese, but I can
assure you that my concerns are not nationalist or racist in nature, so I
apologize if they came across as such. I was raised under another
oppressive regime, the US government, so I am sympathetic to the problems
of the Chinese people.
I am in fact only concerned with the very real fact that a majority of the
Bitcoin network's hashing power is centralized within the political borders
of one country and consequently the entire Bitcoin economy is at risk of
political manipulation. I have seen frequent instances within my own
homeland where the government has seized control over private businesses
through draconian regulation. I have witnessed in other countries where
businesses are seized and nationalized more directly. I am concerned that
the Chinese government might decide to nationalize the Bitcoin mines within
its borders, and what they might do with 57% of the network hashing power.
If it were any other country I would be equally concerned. But it's not any
other country. It's China. And I don't trust the Chinese government any
more than I trust any other government not to take actions that might harm
Bitcoin.
On Aug 2, 2015 8:21 PM, "Pindar Wong" <pindar.wong@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear Jim,
>
> Thank you for sharing your view w.r.t. the so called 'Chinese Miners'.
>
> Diversity of opinion, and mining, are IMHO both good and it's indeed a
> free world.... so others who wish to mine bitcoin should be encouraged to
> make the capital and technical investments to do so.
>
> May I ask what is your technical suggestion to move this discussion
> forward beyond your anti-Chinese/anti-China rhetoric? e.g. I would be
> particularly grateful if you could share your views w.r.t. colluding miner
> attacks in draft 0.5.9. of Joseph Poon and Thaddeus Dryja's 'Lightning
> network' paper, found here:-
>
> http://lightning.network/lightning-network-paper.pdf
>
> Respectfully,
>
> p.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 3, 2015 at 4:02 AM, Jim Phillips via bitcoin-dev <
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>
>> China is a communist country. It is no secret that all "capitalist"
>> enterprises are essentially State controlled, or at the very least are
>> subject to nationalization should the State deem it necessary. Most ASIC
>> chips are manufactured in China, so they are cheap and accessible to
>> Chinese miners. Electricity is subsidized and essentially free. Cooling is
>> not an issue since large parts of China are mountainous and naturally cool.
>> In short the Chinese miners have HUGE advantages over all other mining
>> operations. This is probably why, between just the top 4 Chinese miners,
>> the People's Republic of China effectively controls 57% of all the Bitcoin
>> being mined.
>>
>> The ONLY disadvantage the Chinese miners have in competing with the rest
>> of the world is bandwidth. China has poor connectivity with the rest of the
>> world, and Chinese miners have said that an increase in the block size
>> would be detrimental to them. I say, GOOD! Most of the free world has
>> enough bandwidth to be able to handle larger blocks. We need to take
>> advantage of that fact to get mining out of the centralized control of the
>> Chinese.
>>
>> If you're truly worried about larger blocks causing centralization, think
>> about how, by restricting blocksize, you're enabling the Communist Chinese
>> government to maintain centralized control over 57% of the Bitcoin hashing
>> power.
>>
>> --
>> *James G. Phillips IV*
>> <https://plus.google.com/u/0/113107039501292625391/posts>
>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/ergophobe>
>>
>> *"Don't bunt. Aim out of the ball park. Aim for the company of
>> immortals." -- David Ogilvy*
>>
>> *This message was created with 100% recycled electrons. Please think
>> twice before printing.*
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> bitcoin-dev mailing list
>> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>>
>>
>
--e89a8f235739029381051c60ac66
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<p dir=3D"ltr">I realize that my argument may have come across as anti-Chin=
ese, but I can assure you that my concerns are not nationalist or racist in=
nature, so I apologize if they came across as such. I was raised under ano=
ther oppressive regime, the US government, so I am sympathetic to the probl=
ems of the Chinese people. </p>
<p dir=3D"ltr">I am in fact only concerned with the very real fact that a m=
ajority of the Bitcoin network's hashing power is centralized within th=
e political borders of one country and consequently the entire Bitcoin econ=
omy is at risk of political manipulation. I have seen frequent instances wi=
thin my own homeland where the government has seized control over private b=
usinesses through draconian regulation. I have witnessed in other countries=
where businesses are seized and nationalized more directly. I am concerned=
that the Chinese government might decide to nationalize the Bitcoin mines =
within its borders, and what they might do with 57% of the network hashing =
power. </p>
<p dir=3D"ltr">If it were any other country I would be equally concerned. B=
ut it's not any other country. It's China. And I don't trust th=
e Chinese government any more than I trust any other government not to take=
actions that might harm Bitcoin. </p>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Aug 2, 2015 8:21 PM, "Pindar Wong" =
<<a href=3D"mailto:pindar.wong@gmail.com">pindar.wong@gmail.com</a>> =
wrote:<br type=3D"attribution"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"l=
tr"><div><div>Dear Jim,<br><br></div>Thank you for sharing your view w.r.t.=
the so called 'Chinese Miners'.=C2=A0 <br><br>Diversity of opinion=
, and mining, are IMHO both good and it's indeed a=C2=A0 free world....=
so others who wish to mine bitcoin should be encouraged=C2=A0 to make the =
capital and technical investments to do so. <br><br>May I ask what is your =
technical suggestion to move this discussion forward beyond your anti-Chine=
se/anti-China rhetoric?=C2=A0=C2=A0 e.g. I would be particularly grateful i=
f you could share your=C2=A0 views w.r.t. colluding miner attacks in draft =
0.5.9. of Joseph Poon and Thaddeus Dryja's 'Lightning network' =
paper, found here:-<br><br><a href=3D"http://lightning.network/lightning-ne=
twork-paper.pdf" target=3D"_blank">http://lightning.network/lightning-netwo=
rk-paper.pdf</a><br><br>Respectfully,<br><br>p.<br></div><div><div><br><br>=
</div></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"=
>On Mon, Aug 3, 2015 at 4:02 AM, Jim Phillips via bitcoin-dev <span dir=3D"=
ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D=
"_blank">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>></span> wrote:<br><bl=
ockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #=
ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>China is a communist coun=
try. It is no secret that all "capitalist" enterprises are essent=
ially State controlled, or at the very least are subject to nationalization=
should the State deem it necessary. Most ASIC chips are manufactured in Ch=
ina, so they are cheap and accessible to Chinese miners. Electricity is sub=
sidized and essentially free. Cooling is not an issue since large parts of =
China are mountainous and naturally cool. In short the Chinese miners have =
HUGE advantages over all other mining operations. This is probably why, bet=
ween just the top 4 Chinese miners, the People's Republic of China effe=
ctively controls 57% of all the Bitcoin being mined.</div><div><br></div><d=
iv>The ONLY disadvantage the Chinese miners have in competing with the rest=
of the world is bandwidth. China has poor connectivity with the rest of th=
e world, and Chinese miners have said that an increase in the block size wo=
uld be detrimental to them. I say, GOOD! Most of the free world has enough =
bandwidth to be able to handle larger blocks. We need to take advantage of =
that fact to get mining out of the centralized control of the Chinese.</div=
><div><br></div><div>If you're truly worried about larger blocks causin=
g centralization, think about how, by restricting blocksize, you're ena=
bling the Communist Chinese government to maintain centralized control over=
57% of the Bitcoin hashing power.</div><div><br></div><div><div><div>--<di=
v><b>James G. Phillips IV</b>=C2=A0<a href=3D"https://plus.google.com/u/0/1=
13107039501292625391/posts" style=3D"font-size:x-small" target=3D"_blank"><=
img src=3D"https://ssl.gstatic.com/images/icons/gplus-16.png"></a>=C2=A0<a =
href=3D"http://www.linkedin.com/in/ergophobe" target=3D"_blank"><img src=3D=
"http://developer.linkedin.com/sites/default/files/LinkedIn_Logo16px.png"><=
/a></div></div><div><font size=3D"1"><i>"Don't bunt. Aim out of th=
e ball park. Aim for the company of immortals." -- David Ogilvy<br></i=
></font><div><font size=3D"1"><br></font></div></div><div><font size=3D"1">=
<img src=3D"http://findicons.com/files/icons/1156/fugue/16/leaf.png">=C2=A0=
<em style=3D"background-color:rgb(255,255,255);font-family:verdana,geneva,s=
ans-serif;line-height:16px;color:green">This message was created with 100% =
recycled electrons. Please think twice before printing.</em></font></div></=
div></div>
</div>
<br>_______________________________________________<br>
bitcoin-dev mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank">=
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" =
rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mail=
man/listinfo/bitcoin-dev</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>
</blockquote></div>
--e89a8f235739029381051c60ac66--
|
