summaryrefslogtreecommitdiff
path: root/14/7bd35fedd3aea0ad14b00f15b48569492f3a75
blob: d88fd05b7d8687261af75c2b2c58d61e7dcba3b4 (plain)
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
Return-Path: <gmaxwell@gmail.com>
Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org
	[172.17.192.35])
	by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4C6E7B66
	for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
	Mon,  8 May 2017 23:56:51 +0000 (UTC)
X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6
Received: from mail-ua0-f170.google.com (mail-ua0-f170.google.com
	[209.85.217.170])
	by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D48E710A
	for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
	Mon,  8 May 2017 23:56:50 +0000 (UTC)
Received: by mail-ua0-f170.google.com with SMTP id j17so33131667uag.3
	for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>;
	Mon, 08 May 2017 16:56:50 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025;
	h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id
	:subject:to:cc;
	bh=EPSMAFBxhmmSL81pLyI77vxUxT6GmapYVnqNovsDaQI=;
	b=MHb8xGT+uURlCMyUYS4/EoKmU4e5k6eT8uSr1soPpzsQvvDjnZA4+YdumbWiy9JIHb
	tJ/7vtruQxtAKJ8R/WGkyXrhUlKoEYFLyiykaL35j/mLNODRwXWfSN8G52WbeKcIs35b
	4aKl69CK6widXuORZcC3/6REygauPE/z+ohhxXTG6puAHH+y6Eoa/VbtrHLc1DrH798m
	BpcTwsKdPVC6PG4HymMoGqKkOkTgwcaRlq9ZvjgpDXgyTurz6C3pFqBoixT2qhRp7VMW
	34D7RkpqWzE3nJwhIGua/zZlZ4hL6DF02hSIXWxLLRiIW71Kgt9WDyLufaXrsjBPiZ+M
	E/OA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
	d=1e100.net; s=20161025;
	h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from
	:date:message-id:subject:to:cc;
	bh=EPSMAFBxhmmSL81pLyI77vxUxT6GmapYVnqNovsDaQI=;
	b=Qqwg1UPzIpKrJm5cnP9yst3jRYnN/I0pxy8QjcUgE6+/SYTeiSlmZpS7Kw5NIgcQci
	2M2ErBYpeLqafqmo/tsRLtjkfZFV4sFiJpQRZVA07bbMmqR/olKp9ymMK4us7S/eVJz+
	NdX0CwLL8PMR6D8WZpXhBHlmNimHa4IKhFzWlh7Sn3qaJT0OOCNGlCSKgdty+m0NvrXw
	QfxtAkqb9x7TxMcLjSCyNry+kFKus7VmylWR5yzHyEB7q/cJiiogXigu8niF6qU4Nfov
	js06cdNMuLL6AZ8nk3UTAXIoLmqdiFjhCWNYOt+hHBKvbdW3efsbXaF/hHdKwei9nJu+
	PROQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: AODbwcBrM3FlMnuFlDtInGhfTqL+VrLEMidF1fKjRwKIy317TcrRFP9t
	kvVvAdSfie/W+EL7UdmqR8EBnZKF6Q==
X-Received: by 10.159.32.66 with SMTP id 60mr1858698uam.78.1494287810023; Mon,
	08 May 2017 16:56:50 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: gmaxwell@gmail.com
Received: by 10.103.20.66 with HTTP; Mon, 8 May 2017 16:56:49 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <CAKzdR-qojNn8OtUTPbxa0JauK9nmo2ZGm4ihKuyzsz_FAgokDw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKzdR-qojNn8OtUTPbxa0JauK9nmo2ZGm4ihKuyzsz_FAgokDw@mail.gmail.com>
From: Gregory Maxwell <greg@xiph.org>
Date: Mon, 8 May 2017 23:56:49 +0000
X-Google-Sender-Auth: 7QFwUTdl4jHSsMnuk1WV8QWm284
Message-ID: <CAAS2fgTMi8V3NsaueR72Ewy1V3C0PUvuR7Sv-kgS=oz7oiuSTA@mail.gmail.com>
To: Sergio Demian Lerner <sergio.d.lerner@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED,
	DKIM_VALID, FREEMAIL_FROM,
	RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham version=3.3.1
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on
	smtp1.linux-foundation.org
Cc: bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>, hello@p2sh.info
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Some real-world results about the current Segwit
	Discount
X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>,
	<mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/>
List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>,
	<mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 May 2017 23:56:51 -0000

On Mon, May 8, 2017 at 10:42 PM, Sergio Demian Lerner via bitcoin-dev
<bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> The non-witness data weight factor should not be 4 but 2.35. The closest
> integer value is 2, which leads to a 50% witness discount.

Sergio, You've provided absolutely no information to qualify your
"should be".  It sounds like you are only measuring how much data is
witness vs non-witness while completely ignoring the relative cost of
UTXO bloat?  It's perfectly acceptable to increase the worst case in
one dimension while decreasing it in another-- and thats what segwit
does.

This sounds like a misunderstanding of what the factors should have
accomplish. The non-witness factor should be as large as possible
because the prunable witness data has little to no long term cost to
the system, no cost to lite clients, etc-- as eventually the system's
survival will require transitioning to starting from a state snapshot.
But it cannot be too large because of the hyperbolic increase in worst
case bandwidth.   Also, when starting from a state snapshot security
will require starting from an old one-- otherwise the whole system
becomes much closer to SPV security, so the cost of witness data
between there and the tip will still matter.

If I had any leaning to adjust it, it would be towards five-- not
towards even lower values.

> The Bitcoinj source code is available for anyone to review.

Where is it? (I have to say, I haven't found bitcoinj based things at
all readable but it would be worth seeing.)