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| author | odinn <odinn.cyberguerrilla@riseup.net> | 2015-03-23 02:44:56 +0000 |
|---|---|---|
| committer | bitcoindev <bitcoindev@gnusha.org> | 2015-03-23 02:45:13 +0000 |
| commit | ae06d94934f12809350e3a1a9352cc1c090e417d (patch) | |
| tree | 8949de9ebed00725a23c9e80c6a35c51de7e284d | |
| parent | 5b555cb2cfc732ea4355662c729c8858ba71a79f (diff) | |
| download | pi-bitcoindev-ae06d94934f12809350e3a1a9352cc1c090e417d.tar.gz pi-bitcoindev-ae06d94934f12809350e3a1a9352cc1c090e417d.zip | |
Re: [Bitcoin-development] Criminal complaints against "network disruption as a service" startups
| -rw-r--r-- | 7b/639c2ec8abe0ce15d95fe899a7fa2bcad0b53c | 218 |
1 files changed, 218 insertions, 0 deletions
diff --git a/7b/639c2ec8abe0ce15d95fe899a7fa2bcad0b53c b/7b/639c2ec8abe0ce15d95fe899a7fa2bcad0b53c new file mode 100644 index 000000000..5e87388a0 --- /dev/null +++ b/7b/639c2ec8abe0ce15d95fe899a7fa2bcad0b53c @@ -0,0 +1,218 @@ +Received: from sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.193] + helo=mx.sourceforge.net) + by sfs-ml-3.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76) + (envelope-from <odinn.cyberguerrilla@riseup.net>) id 1YZsMb-0000Zo-0J + for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; + Mon, 23 Mar 2015 02:45:13 +0000 +Received-SPF: pass (sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com: domain of riseup.net + designates 198.252.153.129 as permitted sender) + client-ip=198.252.153.129; + envelope-from=odinn.cyberguerrilla@riseup.net; + helo=mx1.riseup.net; +Received: from mx1.riseup.net ([198.252.153.129]) + by sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) + (Exim 4.76) id 1YZsMX-0004GS-AR + for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; + Mon, 23 Mar 2015 02:45:12 +0000 +Received: from plantcutter.riseup.net (plantcutter-pn.riseup.net [10.0.1.121]) + (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) + (Client CN "*.riseup.net", + Issuer "COMODO RSA Domain Validation Secure Server CA" (verified OK)) + by mx1.riseup.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4FB6441834 + for <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>; + Mon, 23 Mar 2015 02:45:03 +0000 (UTC) +Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) + (Authenticated sender: odinn.cyberguerrilla) + with ESMTPSA id 00F14227F9 +Message-ID: <550F7E28.2060708@riseup.net> +Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 02:44:56 +0000 +From: odinn <odinn.cyberguerrilla@riseup.net> +MIME-Version: 1.0 +To: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net +References: <55034205.4030607@localhost.local> <CANEZrP2OM6BrEsgqe5j23qaZp7wypOFJOZf+cNuMMe12WBv8LA@mail.gmail.com> + <CABh=4qNwRqb3f+AM-PKB0F+Kaw02tAq2DsqLmeO87XxXZvTd4Q@mail.gmail.com> +In-Reply-To: <CABh=4qNwRqb3f+AM-PKB0F+Kaw02tAq2DsqLmeO87XxXZvTd4Q@mail.gmail.com> +Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 +X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.98.6 at mx1 +X-Virus-Status: Clean +Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable +X-Spam-Score: -1.4 (-) +X-Spam-Report: Spam Filtering performed by mx.sourceforge.net. + See http://spamassassin.org/tag/ for more details. + -1.5 SPF_CHECK_PASS SPF reports sender host as permitted sender for + sender-domain + -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, + no trust [198.252.153.129 listed in list.dnswl.org] + -0.0 SPF_HELO_PASS SPF: HELO matches SPF record + -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay + domain + -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record + 0.1 DKIM_SIGNED Message has a DKIM or DK signature, + not necessarily valid + 0.0 T_DKIM_INVALID DKIM-Signature header exists but is not valid + 0.0 UNPARSEABLE_RELAY Informational: message has unparseable relay + lines +X-Headers-End: 1YZsMX-0004GS-AR +Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Criminal complaints against "network + disruption as a service" startups +X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net +X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 +Precedence: list +List-Id: <bitcoin-development.lists.sourceforge.net> +List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development>, + <mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=unsubscribe> +List-Archive: <http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=bitcoin-development> +List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net> +List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=help> +List-Subscribe: <https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development>, + <mailto:bitcoin-development-request@lists.sourceforge.net?subject=subscribe> +X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 02:45:13 -0000 + +-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- +Hash: SHA512 + +If you (e.g. Chainalysis) or anyone else are doing surveillance on the +network and gathering information for later use, and whether or not +the ultimate purpose is to divulge it to other parties for compliance +purposes, you can bet that ultimately the tables will be turned on +you, and you will be the one having your ass handed to you so to +speak, before or after you are served, in legal parlance. Whether or +not the outcome of that is meaningful and beneficial to any concerned +parties and what is the upshot of it in the end depends on on what you +do and just how far you decide to take your ill-advised enterprise. + +Chainalysis and similar operations would be, IMHO, well advised to +cease operations. This doesn't mean they will, but guess what: + +Shot over the bow, folks. + +Jan M=F8ller: +> What we were trying to achieve was determining the flow of funds +> between countries by figuring out which country a transaction +> originates from. To do that with a certain accuracy you need many +> nodes. We chose a class C IP range as we knew that bitcoin core and +> others only connect to one node in any class C IP range. We were +> not aware that breadwallet didn't follow this practice. Breadwallet +> risked getting tar-pitted, but that was not our intention and we +> are sorry about that. +>=20 +> Our nodes DID respond with valid blocks and merkle-blocks and +> allowed everyone connecting to track the blockchain. We did however +> not relay transactions. The 'service' bit in the version message is +> not meant for telling whether or how the node relays transactions, +> it tells whether you can ask for block headers only or full +> blocks. +>=20 +> Many implementations enforce non standard rules for handling +> transactions; some nodes ignore transactions with address reuse, +> some nodes happily forward double spends, and some nodes forward +> neither blocks not transactions. We did blocks but not +> transactions. +>=20 +> In hindsight we should have done two things: 1. relay transactions=20 +> 2. advertise address from 'foreign' nodes +>=20 +> Both would have fixed the problems that breadwallet experienced. +> My understanding is that breadwallet now has the same 'class C' +> rule as bitcoind, which would also fix it. +>=20 +> Getting back on the topic of this thread and whether it is illegal, +> your guess is as good as mine. I don't think it is illegal to log +> incoming connections and make statistical analysis on it. That +> would more or less incriminate anyone who runs a web-server and +> looks into the access log. At lease one Bitcoin service has been +> collecting IP addresses for years and given them to anyone visiting +> their web-site (you know who) and I believe that this practise is +> very wrong. We have no intention of giving IP addresses away to +> anyone, but we believe that you are free to make statistics on +> connection logs when nodes connect to you. +>=20 +> On a side note: When you make many connections to the network you +> see lots of strange nodes and suspicious patterns. You can be +> certain that we were not the only ones connected to many nodes. +>=20 +> My takeaway from this: If nodes that do not relay transactions is a +> problem then there is stuff to fix. +>=20 +> /Jan +>=20 +> On Fri, Mar 13, 2015 at 10:48 PM, Mike Hearn <mike@plan99.net> +> wrote: +>=20 +>> That would be rather new and tricky legal territory. +>>=20 +>> But even putting the legal issues to one side, there are +>> definitional issues. +>>=20 +>> For instance if the Chainalysis nodes started following the +>> protocol specs better and became just regular nodes that happen +>> to keep logs, would that still be a violation? If so, what about +>> blockchain.info? It'd be shooting ourselves in the foot to try +>> and forbid block explorers given how useful they are. +>>=20 +>> If someone non-maliciously runs some nodes with debug logging +>> turned on, and makes full system backups every night, and keeps +>> those backups for years, are they in violation of whatever +>> pseudo-law is involved? +>>=20 +>> I think it's a bit early to think about these things right now. +>> Michael Gr=F8nager and Jan M=F8ller have been Bitcoin hackers for a +>> long time. I'd be interested to know their thoughts on all of +>> this. +>>=20 +>>=20 +>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------= +-------- +>> +>>=20 +Dive into the World of Parallel Programming The Go Parallel Website, +>> sponsored by Intel and developed in partnership with Slashdot +>> Media, is your hub for all things parallel software development, +>> from weekly thought leadership blogs to news, videos, case +>> studies, tutorials and more. Take a look and join the=20 +>> conversation now. http://goparallel.sourceforge.net/=20 +>> _______________________________________________=20 +>> Bitcoin-development mailing list=20 +>> Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net=20 +>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development +>>=20 +>>=20 +>=20 +>=20 +>=20 +> -----------------------------------------------------------------------= +------- +> +>=20 +Dive into the World of Parallel Programming The Go Parallel Website, +sponsored +> by Intel and developed in partnership with Slashdot Media, is your +> hub for all things parallel software development, from weekly +> thought leadership blogs to news, videos, case studies, tutorials +> and more. Take a look and join the conversation now. +> http://goparallel.sourceforge.net/ +>=20 +>=20 +>=20 +> _______________________________________________ Bitcoin-development +> mailing list Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net=20 +> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development +>=20 + +- --=20 +http://abis.io ~ +"a protocol concept to enable decentralization +and expansion of a giving economy, and a new social good" +https://keybase.io/odinn +-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- + +iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJVD34mAAoJEGxwq/inSG8CvrQH/28Rt26oGdo9rS+PaR1fIQ1p +Jwks11Axsmu5x3emTgIz0xUJ6zz/4ERM0LeNLBpfSFwZyLbuCgw1uiJplT+9uPgY +hPXb9OTNejfWZJjYc3i6rNjf2SNc5E3/4PtgeOI6lI/SsGQ6ineNm6gFjwe8xVpt +wCLOPetzCukQegXluFZZdALnPDf4H9yAeSsrfX2h2iCBAJ3qd9f1DP7+e6hvr+xr +POVBjlRYtnSd/viKJ2IhMbRvnqd86pRNAKEWrjZp0CIkGyY7wh4nqtYErZi4TcOK +H7yhU8o4/mgTNSIYdLTOSMlRi+nTMPWUD2jvO/Z9i9VTR9afn8E7j7iHD6QPMB0=3D +=3DvdbG +-----END PGP SIGNATURE----- + + |