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| author | Matt Corallo <lf-lists@mattcorallo.com> | 2023-10-20 21:55:12 -0400 |
|---|---|---|
| committer | bitcoindev <bitcoindev@gnusha.org> | 2023-10-21 01:55:23 +0000 |
| commit | 7310030c43759993488e70393758ff179750cde0 (patch) | |
| tree | bd8b6bf85f151f72376ac84c7e5f660b1bd91cfa | |
| parent | 5073ba0fb7b77a86337996a22f8d6432a615786e (diff) | |
| download | pi-bitcoindev-7310030c43759993488e70393758ff179750cde0.tar.gz pi-bitcoindev-7310030c43759993488e70393758ff179750cde0.zip | |
Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Lightning-dev] Full Disclosure: CVE-2023-40231 / CVE-2023-40232 / CVE-2023-40233 / CVE-2023-40234 "All your mempool are belong to us"
| -rw-r--r-- | b3/0e486c7897de4a82de02e430602d18d24ed388 | 141 |
1 files changed, 141 insertions, 0 deletions
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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed +Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit +Cc: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>, + security@ariard.me, + "lightning-dev\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\@lists.linuxfoundation.org" + <lightning-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> +Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Lightning-dev] Full Disclosure: CVE-2023-40231 / + CVE-2023-40232 / CVE-2023-40233 / CVE-2023-40234 "All your mempool are + belong to us" +X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org +X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 +Precedence: list +List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org> +List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>, + <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe> +List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/> +List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> +List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help> +List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>, + <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe> +X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2023 01:55:23 -0000 + + + +On 10/20/23 9:25 PM, Peter Todd wrote: +> On Fri, Oct 20, 2023 at 09:03:49PM -0400, Matt Corallo wrote: +>>> What are anchor outputs used for other than increasing fees? +>>> +>>> Because if we've pre-signed the full fee range, there is simply no need for +>>> anchor outputs. Under any circumstance we can broadcast a transaction with a +>>> sufficiently high fee to get mined. +>> +>> +>> Indeed, that is what anchor outputs are for. Removing the pre-set feerate +>> solved a number of issues with edge-cases and helped address the +>> fee-inflation attack. Now, just using pre-signed transactions doesn't have +>> to re-introduce those issues - as long as the broadcaster gets to pick which +>> of the possible transactions they broadcast its just another transaction of +>> theirs. +>> +>> Still, I'm generally really dubious of the multiple pre-signed transaction +>> thing, (a) it would mean more fee overhead (not the end of the world for a +>> force-closure, but it sucks to have all these individual transactions +>> rolling around and be unable to batch), but more importantly (b) its a bunch +>> of overhead to keep track of a ton of variants across a sufficiently +>> granular set of feerates for it to not result in substantially overspending +>> on fees. +> +> Quite the contrary. Schnorr signatures are 64 bytes, so in situations like +> lightning where the transaction form is deterministically derived, signing 100 +> extra transactions requires just 6400 extra bytes. Even a very slow 100KB/s +> connection can transfer that in 64ms; latency will still dominate. + +Lightning today isn't all that much data, but multiply it by 100 and we start racking up data enough +that people may start to have to store a really material amount of data for larger nodes and dealing +with that starts to be a much bigger pain then when we're talking about a GiB or twenty. + +> RBF has a minimum incremental relay fee of 1sat/vByte by default. So if you use +> those 100 pre-signed transaction variants to do nothing more than sign every +> possible minimum incremental relay, you've covered a range of 1sat/vByte to +> 100sat/vByte. I believe that is sufficient to get mined for any block in +> Bitcoin's entire modern history. +> +> CPFP meanwhile requires two transactions, and thus extra bytes. Other than edge +> cases with very large transactions in low-fee environments, there's no +> circumstance where CPFP beats RBF. + +What I was referring to is that if we have the SIGHASH_SINGLE|ANYONECANPAY we can combine many HTLC +claims into one transaction, vs pre-signing means we're stuck with a ton of individual transactions. + +Matt + |