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| author | Jorge Timón <jtimon@jtimon.cc> | 2017-09-30 05:55:58 +0200 |
|---|---|---|
| committer | bitcoindev <bitcoindev@gnusha.org> | 2017-09-30 03:56:01 +0000 |
| commit | 533b6dd4b9652e8783d59e2d2fd79b08b644b61c (patch) | |
| tree | 88b2ea2f1b51d195a44a0801db2d50f6ebda28aa | |
| parent | c3372374f3bc6dba41d77a6874f6d7e82b961e45 (diff) | |
| download | pi-bitcoindev-533b6dd4b9652e8783d59e2d2fd79b08b644b61c.tar.gz pi-bitcoindev-533b6dd4b9652e8783d59e2d2fd79b08b644b61c.zip | |
Re: [bitcoin-dev] Rebatable fees & incentive-safe fee markets
| -rw-r--r-- | fa/b95b9e60c04db93a7ebc6d25f0c1832e7c6a52 | 189 |
1 files changed, 189 insertions, 0 deletions
diff --git a/fa/b95b9e60c04db93a7ebc6d25f0c1832e7c6a52 b/fa/b95b9e60c04db93a7ebc6d25f0c1832e7c6a52 new file mode 100644 index 000000000..66e1f7920 --- /dev/null +++ b/fa/b95b9e60c04db93a7ebc6d25f0c1832e7c6a52 @@ -0,0 +1,189 @@ +Return-Path: <jtimon@jtimon.cc> +Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org + [172.17.192.35]) + by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 60645910 + for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>; + Sat, 30 Sep 2017 03:56:01 +0000 (UTC) +X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 +Received: from mail-vk0-f44.google.com (mail-vk0-f44.google.com + [209.85.213.44]) + by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C6CF441E + for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>; + Sat, 30 Sep 2017 03:56:00 +0000 (UTC) +Received: by mail-vk0-f44.google.com with SMTP id w23so759582vkw.2 + for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>; + Fri, 29 Sep 2017 20:56:00 -0700 (PDT) +DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; + d=jtimon-cc.20150623.gappssmtp.com; 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Fri, + 29 Sep 2017 20:55:59 -0700 (PDT) +MIME-Version: 1.0 +Received: by 10.31.79.199 with HTTP; Fri, 29 Sep 2017 20:55:58 -0700 (PDT) +Received: by 10.31.79.199 with HTTP; Fri, 29 Sep 2017 20:55:58 -0700 (PDT) +In-Reply-To: <CABm2gDqXXvNCZ7EyKuwudB5J0YDX7hNnXHPZNxTO0_JsM+yNHg@mail.gmail.com> +References: <CAEgR2PGCZ=F85yjAbZgC6NtzhpdgBL3n4M2jowN12wJ7x-Ai1A@mail.gmail.com> + <CAEgR2PGrxDQE0k8WX4XXz9GN-RAL6JB51ST9Hdz=ba36gRCa6A@mail.gmail.com> + <CAEgR2PFjt=ihzRBhNXbHTAJz1R+3vz8o-zRZkDA3iBo39x9cTQ@mail.gmail.com> + <CAEgR2PFfSjJjkTYq+DAmTzmkHPxqhn6fUDoXTzrRebz+OoUgqw@mail.gmail.com> + <CAEgR2PG5ZueHKDXbsPDEjQG7xAYBa_JAtPZo9n1V2=STC1srpA@mail.gmail.com> + <CAEgR2PGPQ1e9SmoWOS3V+N9v+OWiM4g3nPN3d9urc+DfkWEJ7A@mail.gmail.com> + <CAEgR2PEKkHH6+Sh8cQGF83-s1tpwQZgd0fiuNz_xyWu0mUPfCA@mail.gmail.com> + <CAEgR2PEyWFO1RFohVEpcb-M7aM-8xjCFvDPeJPD4zF4yTCyZ0A@mail.gmail.com> + <CAEgR2PGrf+4pQRyNC_xKVEKXimKTWveGK9q6YJeZkG0_r=8tkg@mail.gmail.com> + <5F7A4F74-B108-4E30-A3F4-4125BBD0F819@friedenbach.org> + <CABm2gDqXXvNCZ7EyKuwudB5J0YDX7hNnXHPZNxTO0_JsM+yNHg@mail.gmail.com> +From: =?UTF-8?B?Sm9yZ2UgVGltw7Nu?= <jtimon@jtimon.cc> +Date: Sat, 30 Sep 2017 05:55:58 +0200 +Message-ID: <CABm2gDqmOXGZ_qxyNjFYg8qTRu4Tmo7V+zYZCt0j5RekUNVkWw@mail.gmail.com> +To: Mark <mark@friedenbach.org>, + Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> +Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c14a38491edca055a601eb5" +X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.5 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, + HTML_MESSAGE,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE,RCVD_IN_SORBS_SPAM autolearn=disabled + version=3.3.1 +X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on + smtp1.linux-foundation.org +Cc: Daniele Pinna <daniele.pinna@gmail.com> +Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Rebatable fees & incentive-safe fee markets +X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org +X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 +Precedence: list +List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org> +List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>, + <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe> +List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/> +List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> +List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help> +List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>, + <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe> +X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 30 Sep 2017 03:56:01 -0000 + +--94eb2c14a38491edca055a601eb5 +Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" +Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable + +Gmaxwell I think what's new is that in this case, with a single tx you +would take out all txs with fee below 1 btc. With current rules, you would +only remove enoguh txs for that one to fit, not empty the whole block and +mine only a block with that single tx. + +On 30 Sep 2017 5:53 am, "Jorge Tim=C3=B3n" <jtimon@jtimon.cc> wrote: + +> I really don't see how this "outlier behaviour" can be prevented. I think +> it would be the norm even with your proposed "fix". Perhaps I'm missing +> something too. +> +> On 29 Sep 2017 5:24 pm, "Mark Friedenbach via bitcoin-dev" < +> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote: +> +>> This is correct. Under assumptions of a continuous mempool model however +>> this should be considered the outlier behavior, other than a little bit = +of +>> empty space at the end, now and then. A maximum fee rate calculated as a +>> filter over past block rates could constrain this outlier behavior from +>> ever happening too. +>> +>> > On Sep 29, 2017, at 3:43 AM, Daniele Pinna <daniele.pinna@gmail.com> +>> wrote: +>> > +>> > Maybe I'm getting this wrong but wouldn't this scheme imply that a +>> miner is incentivized to limit the amount of transactions in a block to +>> capture the maximum fee of the ones included? +>> > +>> > As an example, mined blocks currently carry ~0.8 btc in fees right now= +. +>> If I were to submit a transaction paying 1 btc in maximal money fees, th= +en +>> the miner would be incentivized to include my transaction alone to avoid +>> that lower fee paying transactions reduce the amount of fees he can earn +>> from my transaction alone. This would mean that I could literally clog t= +he +>> network by paying 1btc every ten minutes. +>> > +>> > Am I missing something? +>> > +>> > Daniele +>> _______________________________________________ +>> bitcoin-dev mailing list +>> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org +>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev +>> +> + +--94eb2c14a38491edca055a601eb5 +Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" +Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable + +<div dir=3D"auto">Gmaxwell I think what's new is that in this case, wit= +h a single tx you would take out all txs with fee below 1 btc. With current= + rules, you would only remove enoguh txs for that one to fit, not empty the= + whole block and mine only a block with that single tx.</div><div class=3D"= +gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 30 Sep 2017 5:53 am, "J= +orge Tim=C3=B3n" <jtimon@jtimon.cc> wrote:<br type=3D"attributio= +n"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left= +:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"auto">I really don't see = +how this "outlier behaviour" can be prevented. I think it would b= +e the norm even with your proposed "fix". Perhaps I'm missing= + something too.</div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quo= +te">On 29 Sep 2017 5:24 pm, "Mark Friedenbach via bitcoin-dev" &l= +t;<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank= +">bitcoin-dev@lists.<wbr>linuxfoundation.org</a>> wrote:<br type=3D"attr= +ibution"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;borde= +r-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">This is correct. Under assumptions = +of a continuous mempool model however this should be considered the outlier= + behavior, other than a little bit of empty space at the end, now and then.= + A maximum fee rate calculated as a filter over past block rates could cons= +train this outlier behavior from ever happening too.<br> +<br> +> On Sep 29, 2017, at 3:43 AM, Daniele Pinna <<a href=3D"mailto:danie= +le.pinna@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">daniele.pinna@gmail.com</a>> wrote= +:<br> +><br> +> Maybe I'm getting this wrong but wouldn't this scheme imply th= +at a miner is incentivized to limit the amount of transactions in a block t= +o capture the maximum fee of the ones included?<br> +><br> +> As an example, mined blocks currently carry ~0.8 btc in fees right now= +. If I were to submit a transaction paying 1 btc in maximal money fees, the= +n the miner would be incentivized to include my transaction alone to avoid = +that lower fee paying transactions reduce the amount of fees he can earn fr= +om my transaction alone. This would mean that I could literally clog the ne= +twork by paying 1btc every ten minutes.<br> +><br> +> Am I missing something?<br> +><br> +> Daniele<br> +______________________________<wbr>_________________<br> +bitcoin-dev mailing list<br> +<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank">= +bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundat<wbr>ion.org</a><br> +<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" = +rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundation.<wbr>org= +/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-d<wbr>ev</a><br> +</blockquote></div></div> +</blockquote></div></div> + +--94eb2c14a38491edca055a601eb5-- + |