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| author | Adam Ritter <aritter@gmail.com> | 2018-01-06 08:05:11 -0200 |
|---|---|---|
| committer | bitcoindev <bitcoindev@gnusha.org> | 2018-01-06 10:05:14 +0000 |
| commit | 369160042a1d4543b07b5eabae13230dd5de4002 (patch) | |
| tree | 43095e343cf14a4f0b0d4f489e3404d79cbd360b | |
| parent | edfaea90d36d6074ae04256040f0adb8c78d9119 (diff) | |
| download | pi-bitcoindev-369160042a1d4543b07b5eabae13230dd5de4002.tar.gz pi-bitcoindev-369160042a1d4543b07b5eabae13230dd5de4002.zip | |
Re: [bitcoin-dev] Bech32 and P2SH²
| -rw-r--r-- | 25/572d3a7c91e6c372edf00106aa67c376c2164a | 234 |
1 files changed, 234 insertions, 0 deletions
diff --git a/25/572d3a7c91e6c372edf00106aa67c376c2164a b/25/572d3a7c91e6c372edf00106aa67c376c2164a new file mode 100644 index 000000000..5e1b39ebe --- /dev/null +++ b/25/572d3a7c91e6c372edf00106aa67c376c2164a @@ -0,0 +1,234 @@ +Return-Path: <aritter@gmail.com> +Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org + [172.17.192.35]) + by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 08412B2B + for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>; + Sat, 6 Jan 2018 10:05:14 +0000 (UTC) +X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 +Received: from mail-qt0-f177.google.com (mail-qt0-f177.google.com + [209.85.216.177]) + by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 64EB314D + for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>; + Sat, 6 Jan 2018 10:05:13 +0000 (UTC) +Received: by mail-qt0-f177.google.com with SMTP id e2so8551109qti.0 + for <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>; + Sat, 06 Jan 2018 02:05:13 -0800 (PST) +DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; 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+ Sat, 06 Jan 2018 02:05:12 -0800 (PST) +MIME-Version: 1.0 +Received: by 10.12.166.137 with HTTP; Sat, 6 Jan 2018 02:05:11 -0800 (PST) +In-Reply-To: <CAAS2fgQT33QhZrSoGvi=_i0pREuqU+A82zSekFkC1M8av+ufRA@mail.gmail.com> +References: <201801041423.05959.luke@dashjr.org> + <CAAS2fgQT33QhZrSoGvi=_i0pREuqU+A82zSekFkC1M8av+ufRA@mail.gmail.com> +From: Adam Ritter <aritter@gmail.com> +Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2018 08:05:11 -0200 +Message-ID: <CAKuKjyV9aFzVY0__N=P1U4+_zbidZruRFsnD1H9W0aAZhOwsQg@mail.gmail.com> +To: Gregory Maxwell <greg@xiph.org>, + Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> +Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a113eff4e6bb062056218b3bb" +X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.0 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, + DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU, FREEMAIL_FROM, HTML_MESSAGE, + RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 +X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on + smtp1.linux-foundation.org +X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 06 Jan 2018 14:21:49 +0000 +Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] =?utf-8?q?Bech32_and_P2SH=C2=B2?= +X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org +X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 +Precedence: list +List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org> +List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>, + <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe> +List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/> +List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> +List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help> +List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>, + <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe> +X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2018 10:05:14 -0000 + +--001a113eff4e6bb062056218b3bb +Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" +Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable + +The question that I didn't see answered in the Bech32 proposal is why +something like the BIP39 mnemoic format is not used for addresses as well. +There was a lot of math involved in creating it, but I'm not sure how much +user experience testing. + +I realized how much harder it is to copy random letters and numbers than +simple words only when I copied an addresses and a private keys by hand, +and even after I knew that I made a mistake, it took significant effort to +find the place of the mistake. + +In contrast with BIP39 seeds I never made a mistake when writing down +(although I have seen a case where somebody made a mistake because a word +was twice in the same seed, but this is something that could be fixed). + + +On Fri, Jan 5, 2018 at 10:44 PM, Gregory Maxwell via bitcoin-dev < +bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote: + +> P2SH^2 wasn't a serious proposal-- I just suggested it as a thought +> experiment. I don't think it offers much useful in the context of +> Bitcoin today. Particularly since weight calculations have made output +> space relatively more expensive and fees are at quite non-negligible +> rates interest in "storing data" in outputs should at least not be +> increasing. +> +> Moreover, unfortunately, people already rushed bech32 to market in +> advance of practically any public review-- regrettable but it is what +> it is... I don't think adding more address diversity at this time +> wouldn't be good for the ecosystem. +> +> What we might want to do is consider working on an address-next +> proposal that has an explicit timeframe of N years out, and very loud +> don't deploy this--- layered hashing is just one very minor slightly +> nice to have... things like coded expiration times, abilities to have +> amounts under checksum, etc. are probably more worth consideration. +> +> +> +> On Thu, Jan 4, 2018 at 2:23 PM, Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev +> <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote: +> > I know I'm super-late to bring this up, but was there a reason Bech32 +> omitted +> > the previously-discussed P2SH=C2=B2 improvements? Since deployment isn'= +t too +> > widespread yet, maybe it'd be worth a quick revision to add this? +> > +> > For those unfamiliar with the concept, the idea is to have the address +> include +> > the *single* SHA256 hash of the public key or script, rather than +> > RIPEMD160(SHA256(pubkey)) or SHA256(SHA256(script)). The sender would +> then +> > perform the second hash to produce the output. Doing this would in the +> future +> > enable relaying the "middle-hash" as a way to prove the final hash is i= +n +> fact +> > a hash itself, thereby proving it is not embedded data spam. +> > +> > Bech32 seems like a huge missed opportunity to add this, since everyone +> will +> > probably be upgrading to it at some point. +> > +> > Luke +> > _______________________________________________ +> > bitcoin-dev mailing list +> > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org +> > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev +> _______________________________________________ +> bitcoin-dev mailing list +> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org +> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev +> + +--001a113eff4e6bb062056218b3bb +Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" +Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable + +<div dir=3D"ltr">The question that I didn't see answered in the Bech32 = +proposal is why something like the BIP39 mnemoic format is not used for add= +resses as well. There was a lot of math involved in creating it, but I'= +m not sure how much user experience testing.<div><br><div>I realized how mu= +ch harder it is to copy random letters and numbers than simple words only w= +hen I copied an addresses and a private keys by hand, and even after I knew= + that I made a mistake, it took significant effort to find the place of the= + mistake.</div><div><br></div><div>In contrast with BIP39 seeds I never mad= +e a mistake when writing down (although I have seen a case where somebody m= +ade a mistake because a word was twice in the same seed, but this is someth= +ing that could be fixed).</div><div><br></div></div></div><div class=3D"gma= +il_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Jan 5, 2018 at 10:44 PM, G= +regory Maxwell via bitcoin-dev <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:bitc= +oin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" target=3D"_blank">bitcoin-dev@lists.linu= +xfoundation.org</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" = +style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">P2S= +H^2 wasn't a serious proposal-- I just suggested it as a thought<br> +experiment. I don't think it offers much useful in the context of<br> +Bitcoin today. Particularly since weight calculations have made output<br> +space relatively more expensive and fees are at quite non-negligible<br> +rates interest in "storing data" in outputs should at least not b= +e<br> +increasing.<br> +<br> +Moreover, unfortunately, people already rushed bech32 to market in<br> +advance of practically any public review-- regrettable but it is what<br> +it is... I don't think adding more address diversity at this time<br> +wouldn't be good for the ecosystem.<br> +<br> +What we might want to do is consider working on an address-next<br> +proposal that has an explicit timeframe of N years out, and very loud<br> +don't deploy this--- layered hashing is just one very minor slightly<br= +> +nice to have... things like coded expiration times, abilities to have<br> +amounts under checksum, etc. are probably more worth consideration.<br> +<div class=3D"HOEnZb"><div class=3D"h5"><br> +<br> +<br> +On Thu, Jan 4, 2018 at 2:23 PM, Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev<br> +<<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@li= +sts.<wbr>linuxfoundation.org</a>> wrote:<br> +> I know I'm super-late to bring this up, but was there a reason Bec= +h32 omitted<br> +> the previously-discussed P2SH=C2=B2 improvements? Since deployment isn= +'t too<br> +> widespread yet, maybe it'd be worth a quick revision to add this?<= +br> +><br> +> For those unfamiliar with the concept, the idea is to have the address= + include<br> +> the *single* SHA256 hash of the public key or script, rather than<br> +> RIPEMD160(SHA256(pubkey)) or SHA256(SHA256(script)). The sender would = +then<br> +> perform the second hash to produce the output. Doing this would in the= + future<br> +> enable relaying the "middle-hash" as a way to prove the fina= +l hash is in fact<br> +> a hash itself, thereby proving it is not embedded data spam.<br> +><br> +> Bech32 seems like a huge missed opportunity to add this, since everyon= +e will<br> +> probably be upgrading to it at some point.<br> +><br> +> Luke<br> +> ______________________________<wbr>_________________<br> +> bitcoin-dev mailing list<br> +> <a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@l= +ists.<wbr>linuxfoundation.org</a><br> +> <a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-= +dev" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundation.<wb= +r>org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-<wbr>dev</a><br> +______________________________<wbr>_________________<br> +bitcoin-dev mailing list<br> +<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.= +<wbr>linuxfoundation.org</a><br> +<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" = +rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundation.<wbr>org= +/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-<wbr>dev</a><br> +</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div> + +--001a113eff4e6bb062056218b3bb-- + |