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authorTom Harding <tomh@thinlink.com>2014-08-06 07:44:25 -0700
committerbitcoindev <bitcoindev@gnusha.org>2014-08-06 14:44:35 +0000
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parentc1d683d510ca6ac9127d9d90fa318c32091ea2e9 (diff)
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Re: [Bitcoin-development] deterministic transaction expiration
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+Message-ID: <53E23F49.3020605@thinlink.com>
+Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2014 07:44:25 -0700
+From: Tom Harding <tomh@thinlink.com>
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+To: Jeff Garzik <jgarzik@bitpay.com>, Mike Hearn <mike@plan99.net>
+References: <CA+iPb=HkxeVPF0SynxCPgUkq4msrdfayFrVNFjzg29rFwqXv1w@mail.gmail.com> <CAJHLa0O2wFq2Vs5Bes_8x1q_j0VC+U4DQkx=6GqT8w5e8Lh5Qg@mail.gmail.com> <CA+iPb=ET+A-qB8TgPX8D-ut1DWnq9tZJ=14igfRVWO6eog6Xgw@mail.gmail.com> <53E1A8AF.4030206@thinlink.com> <CAJHLa0MfRhCPX8H92qc1kSebc=WrUzmSgbG331t4-zDHhTNu4w@mail.gmail.com>
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+Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
+Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] deterministic transaction expiration
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+
+How is eventual expiration of a tx that started life with an nLockTime
+in the future "breaking", any more than any other tx expiring?
+
+
+On 8/6/2014 6:54 AM, Mike Hearn wrote:
+> We could however introduce a new field in a new tx version. We know we
+> need to rev the format at some point anyway.
+>
+>
+> On Wed, Aug 6, 2014 at 2:55 PM, Jeff Garzik <jgarzik@bitpay.com
+> <mailto:jgarzik@bitpay.com>> wrote:
+>
+> ...and existing users and uses of nLockTime suddenly become
+> worthless, breaking payment channel refunds and other active uses
+> of nLockTime.
+>
+> You cannot assume the user is around to rewrite their nLockTime,
+> if it fails to be confirmed before some arbitrary deadline being set.
+>
+>
+>
+> On Wed, Aug 6, 2014 at 12:01 AM, Tom Harding <tomh@thinlink.com
+> <mailto:tomh@thinlink.com>> wrote:
+>
+> ...
+>
+
+> If nLockTime is used for expiration, transaction creator can't
+> lie to
+> help tx live longer without pushing initial confirmation
+> eligibility
+> into the future. Very pretty. It would also enable "fill or
+> kill"
+> transactions with a backdated nLockTime, which must be
+> confirmed in a
+> few blocks, or start vanishing from mempools.
+>
+
+
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+ <head>
+ <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type">
+ </head>
+ <body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
+ <br>
+ How is eventual expiration of a tx that started life with an
+ nLockTime in the future "breaking", any more than any other tx
+ expiring?<br>
+ <br>
+ <br>
+ <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 8/6/2014 6:54 AM, Mike Hearn wrote:<br>
+ </div>
+ <blockquote
+cite="mid:CANEZrP3eEiLxYfsAURRm4ysfS4TRgXxa_THxJ43cVH1OyR95JQ@mail.gmail.com"
+ type="cite">
+ <div dir="ltr">We could however introduce a new field in a new tx
+ version. We know we need to rev the format at some point anyway.</div>
+ <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
+ <br>
+ <div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Aug 6, 2014 at 2:55 PM, Jeff
+ Garzik <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a moz-do-not-send="true"
+ href="mailto:jgarzik@bitpay.com" target="_blank">jgarzik@bitpay.com</a>&gt;</span>
+ wrote:<br>
+ <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
+ .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
+ <div dir="ltr"> ...and existing users and uses of nLockTime
+ suddenly become worthless, breaking payment channel
+ refunds and other active uses of nLockTime.<br>
+ <br>
+ You cannot assume the user is around to rewrite their
+ nLockTime, if it fails to be confirmed before some
+ arbitrary deadline being set.<br>
+ <br>
+ </div>
+ <div class="gmail_extra">
+ <div>
+ <div class="h5"><br>
+ <br>
+ <div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Aug 6, 2014 at 12:01
+ AM, Tom Harding <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a
+ moz-do-not-send="true"
+ href="mailto:tomh@thinlink.com" target="_blank">tomh@thinlink.com</a>&gt;</span>
+ wrote:<br>
+ <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
+ .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">...<br>
+ </blockquote>
+ </div>
+ </div>
+ </div>
+ </div>
+ </blockquote>
+ </div>
+ </div>
+ </blockquote>
+ <br>
+ <blockquote
+cite="mid:CANEZrP3eEiLxYfsAURRm4ysfS4TRgXxa_THxJ43cVH1OyR95JQ@mail.gmail.com"
+ type="cite">
+ <div class="gmail_extra">
+ <div class="gmail_quote">
+ <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
+ .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
+ <div class="gmail_extra">
+ <div>
+ <div class="h5">
+ <div class="gmail_quote">
+ <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
+ .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
+ If nLockTime is used for expiration, transaction
+ creator can't lie to<br>
+ help tx live longer without pushing initial
+ confirmation eligibility<br>
+ into the future.  Very pretty.  It would also
+ enable "fill or kill"<br>
+ transactions with a backdated nLockTime, which
+ must be confirmed in a<br>
+ few blocks, or start vanishing from mempools.<br>
+ </blockquote>
+ </div>
+ </div>
+ </div>
+ </div>
+ </blockquote>
+ </div>
+ </div>
+ </blockquote>
+ <br>
+ </body>
+</html>
+
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