From: Mike Lorrey (mlorrey@datamann.com)
Date: Thu Jun 27 2002 - 15:43:17 MDT
Since numbers like pi and e do not end, it is impossible to tell if they
are random or not. I doubt that there is any way to tell if something is
'truly random', there are only degrees of randomness. As such, if this
universe is a sim, the computer running it is capable of generating a
degree of randomness that is incalculable by our current technology.
Whether we are able to construct such a computer will be a good test of
our sim-hood.
Alex Ramonsky wrote:
>
> Theory:
>
> Computers, such as we know them, cannot generate true random numbers.
> Computer "random numbers" are in fact pseudo-random. A random number
> "seed" (a hidden variable) cycles through N different values, for some
> large value N. Even "cryptographically strong" random numbers follow the
> same system, the only difference being that N is hideously large.
>
> A random number sequence is obtained by permuting the seed, and
> returning f(seed) for some function f whose range is (in general)
> smaller than N.
>
> With sufficient analysis, it is possible to examine a sequence of
> pseudo-random numbers and determine the pattern - to predict the next
> one. For instance, the C function rand() could be completely predicted
> if you studied a sequence of 2^32 such numbers.
>
> _true_ random numbers have no such pattern. They are truly random. They
> are completely unpredictable, no matter how many of them we study. Or so
> we believe.
>
> Of course, should it turn out that the perceived randomness of, for
> example, sub-atomic decay, were in fact pseudo-random, then it would
> follow logically that we _must_ be in a computer simulation. Or so it
> seems to me.
>
> Ramonsky.
>
> Louis Newstrom wrote:
>
> >From: "Robert J. Bradbury" <bradbury@aeiveos.com>
> >
> >>*But* both Nick Bostrom and Robert Freitas have made some very
> >>interesting arguments regarding the probability that we *are*
> >>in a simulation.
> >>
> >
> >Do you have any pointers or quotes. (Or a thread title I can check in the
> >archives?)
> >
> >So many people seem to say "you couldn't tell", I'd like to hear some
> >arguments from people who think you could tell.
> >
> >
> >
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