From: empresstheodora@juno.com
Date: Thu Jun 20 2002 - 01:38:01 MDT
---------- Max More <max@maxmore.com> writes:
From: Max More <max@maxmore.com>
To: extropians@extropy.org
CC: max@maxmore.com,empresstheodora@juno.com
Subject: Re:Charging for obesity
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 23:51:05 -0700
At 06:23 AM 6/20/2002 +0000, you wrote:
>"God *damn*!"
>
>my thoughts exactly Maxwell
>
>"So, someone has the guts to do this."
>
>read blatant greed
"In this case, "greed" is definitely good."
Greed is never good. Greed is the dehumanizing element in the world and one of the main reasons that we have much afliction in it.
>"Obesity is an out-of-control epidemic in the U.S.A. "
>
>Well when you can't have your ration of millet because bandits took it or
>you have to walk everywhere because your can't afford the $5/gallon fee
>for gasoline then there might be something to it.
"This makes no sense to me."
Simply put the reasons that people may be in fact leaner in various parts of the world. Both of these are valid. I just was hurrying through to get to a point through hyperbole.
>"Those of you who have been squashed on a long plane trip may
>feel that justice is being done in one small way"
>
>*sarcasm*
>Ohhh the horror that someone would have to be accomodiating to someone else!
"Why should we be accommodating (usually you don't have much choice about
being squashed) to someone who lacks respect for their body and health and
who apparently doesn't give a hoot about the discomfort of others."
That is a blatant justification. Why don't you make comnments about the dental state of many people from the British Isles or maybe about male pattern baldness. There is nothing in being fat that is some sort of intense afront to the universe that it's a lack of respect to body and health. Hypochondria is a waste of life and time. If you look at all the advice to eliminate future problems with diseases in your own health you will quickly find that most of the regulations are in fact very time consuming. You spend all of your time preventing and no time liveing.
As far as discomfort of others. Well that is a problem with airlines and their abilities to create a seating chart that all the boys and girls in the class can agree on. Maybe there could be a system of point and click seating for planes along with online ticket purtchessing.
>I feel some good old fashioned American bashing going on.
"Hey, I pay my taxes, I get to bash."
Ahhh but the airline industry has been mostly deregulated (again because of bashing) it's out of the hands of most people.
>Yeah and Ugandans are painfully thin your point?
"I don't think you are that dense. (But you may have high volume, unless
you're just unusually fat-friendly.)"
It's a nice little habbit for most of the world to find fault with America and for the most part I don't really see any point. If people want to eat that is their right and if people don't it's also a right. I remember something about the Germans being a rather fat people but maybe things have changed. My father spent 2 years as a foreign minister in Germany and saw the expandable pants and the copious eating/drinking there. I doubt it's something unique to America.
Plus I believe in the adage. "Eat, Drink, and be Merry for tomorrow we die". I would rather die of a heart attack at let's say 70 than of Alteizmers at 100. Much more dignified and less humiliating.
>How exactly do you assume that there is anything to do with responsibility
>in being fat?
"This comments suggests that you share the beliefs of those who refuse to
take personal responsibility."
Take genetic predisposition, psychological make up, and other diseases and conditions and you lose that precious margin of personal responsibility.
>Why do I as a member of the human race have to take any instructions about
>my mean body weight or fat content?
"No one said that you have to take any instructions. However, it's only fair
for you to pay for taking up the space of two people when limited resources
exist."
What if said resource problem is the fault of gross negligence. I believe another poster pointed out the lack of change in aircraft design and maintaince. People are just looking for the easiest targets. When they try to blame fat people they deflect the problems (at least for a little while) to someone/thing else. Eventually they will re-emerge and start howling at the door.
>That is just a smoke screen. I doubt that this is much of a problem. This
>solely targets individuals of size.
""Individuals of size"?! I have size too, but a healthy amount for my height
and bone structure. I thin you mean "the morbidly obese". Don't mince words."
I don't know why people seem so suprised. People for thousands of years if not longer have been genetically inclined to gain weight to survive lean periods. These people were selected through genetic means to survive better. When more food is avaible of course people will eat and eat better. Also food companies are overcomplicit with regard to such matters in trying to pitch their product.
I am sorry for the strident tone in which I have to state some of these problems but it seems to me that there is some sort of intelligence judgement against people who gain weight. Weight and intelligence decrease do not go hand in hand.
Onward! (But not outward so much!)
Max
P.S. I just realized that I think I know who wrote this. I really hope I'm
wrong.
_______________________________________________________
Max More, Ph.D.
max@maxmore.com or more@extropy.org
http://www.maxmore.com
Strategic Philosopher
President, Extropy Institute. http://www.extropy.org <more@extropy.org>
_______________________________________________________
*****************
"The death of one man is a tragedy the death of a million is a statistic.
________________________________________________________________
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