From: Hal Finney (hal@finney.org)
Date: Fri May 24 2002 - 00:43:10 MDT
Lee Corbin writes:
> Hi Gina!
>
> I'm Lee Corbin, a foresight senior associate, and I'm sorry that
> we haven't met. Mark S. Miller, however, knows me quite well, and
> perhaps that's the same "Miller".
> ...
> As you
> write above, always and uppermost in our minds should
> be saving *everyone's* life. There is no individual
> who has ever lived who doesn't deserve to.
This is very strange. You write a long, friendly-seeming letter in
response to Gina's honest expression of unhappiness, but you completely
avoid addressing the portion where she refers to what you, Lee, have
been saying:
: When it comes to causing harm to children and women, I can not believe
: what I have been reading. If someday, we advance in such a way that we do
: not reproduce, for those on the list who are well read, you may well know
: that there are alternative ways to picking who shall die and murdering them.
: Also, a child is not the equivalent of a cat, (or in fact, to put it
: very simply, they would be cats!) Certain things are not estimates of levels
: of worth, they are just, different.
: I don't believe a parent should have the right to ...........I can't
: even say it. I mean, think about Susan Smith. I don't even understand why
: such a thing is being discussed on this list, and I do not want to associate
: myself with such abuse. Why was the G*n topic banned? (and I really don't
: know this, I'm just wondering, why this?)
: I had a very full sense of self as a child, I remember quite clearly,
: knowing I was a human being, as real as I am now, even though I wasn't
: raised within the normal family situation that most people are either, (not
: left with the wolves, but left) apparently I am not much of a human being if
: defined by one message on this list.
: It doesn't matter if you are 7 or 12, it's tragic to die. It's tragic
: period. One of the biggest battles I hope for advancing technologies to
: prevail over is disease and death.......this is what has brought me here, to
: this group. I am involved with the hopes that we can have happier, longer
: (or infinite) lives.
The main person here who has been advocating THE RIGHT TO CAUSE HARM
TO CHILDREN is you, Lee. While you have always hastened to add that
you oppose hurting and killing children and think it is wrong, you have
consistently said that people should have the right to inflict suffering
and abuse on their children, even to the point of death. You call this
"freedom", and in fact you insist that those of us who would protect the
lives of children are opposed to freedom.
Gina is writing here about the distress she has felt at seeing these
concepts being openly promoted on the list. She can't even bring herself
to openly write the words "kill their child." She talks about how she
felt very much as a person with feelings even when a child, in order to
describe her horror at the suggestion that it could have been legal for
her to have been beaten or killed, or treated as legal property as you
have also suggested.
It strikes me as bizarre that you would respond in your "open letter"
to Gina in such a superficially friendly and open way, but completely
ignore the main issue of contention between you. If you were actually
feeling as friendly as your tone suggested, wouldn't it be honest to
openly address the issues which Gina has raised above? If you cared
about her feelings, you would want to discuss in some manner the ideas
which you have been advancing which are causing her such concern. But you
have conspicuously ignored this major point which made up a substantial
part of Gina's heartfelt expression of dismay. It makes your reply sound
insincere and manipulative, the apparently friendly words being used to
cover up what is actually an absence of concern about her.
I may be reading too much into this; perhaps you overlooked those five
paragraphs above, or did not understand that Gina was expressing her
horror at your suggestion that it should be legal to abuse and kill
children. If so, I apologize. But if not, you should be aware that
your message reads very oddly given your prominent role in the recent
discussions to which Gina was expressing her negative reactions. It is
a friendly-sounding message without any real friendly feeling behind it.
Hal
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