From: Mitchell, Jerry (3337) (Jerry.Mitchell@esavio.com)
Date: Thu Sep 13 2001 - 09:38:54 MDT
> At 09:20 PM 12/09/2001 -0400, Jerry Mitchell wrote:
> >We were attacked because are a symbol of Capitalism and a
> culture based on
> >reason.
>
> Whoa! You are sounding as fanatical as those who attacked
> you. Capitalism
> has little to do with why the attack occurred, and I am sure
> they feel they
> have reason on their side and that they believe they have
> grievances worth
> committing terrible deeds over.
>
> If you just blindly wave the flag then you can just about
> guarantee it will
> happen again. America is not the pure-hearted nation that you seem to
> think. Bin Laden, Gaddaffi, Noriega, Hussein, Marcos,
> Suharto, and other
> nasties were all helped by USA to to do terrible things.
> Truly *awful*
> things were done in Chile and Cambodia that make the WTC pale
> in comparison.
>
> Granted that the dickheads who did the despicable acts on the
> 11th can
> never truly justify such crimes, nevertheless you must ask yourself
> honestly why these things really happened or you will just be
> sticking your
> head in the sand.
>
>
> >It should be built higher and stronger to illustrate our defiance of
> >cultures based on collectivism, religion, and irrationality.
> Make it a
> >monument to achievement and the human spirit. "Reach upward"
> shouldn't just
> >be a metaphor.
>
> The sybolism is beautiful, but be careful that you are not
> just wanting a
> higher altar upon which to sacrifice more innocents for
> warped foreign policy.
>
>
> - Miriam
Miriam, have you not been paying attention to what they are saying? They
think we are the great evil! They hate western culture because it is based
on the principles of self-esteem, reason, and Capitalism, and not sacrifice,
religion, and collectivism. How dare we tip our champagne glasses when
people are starving. How dare we indulge in air-conditioning when there are
so many without it. How dare we be a rich, pleasurable, rational society
when there are so many that aren't! This is a war of ideas. We are fighting
an philosophy here. Bin laten is one little manifestation of that system.
Kill him and 500 more will be cranked out. Its the system that needs to be
removed and ASAP. You didn't see those dancing in the streets? They are just
as guilty as Bin Laden because they support the governments that support the
terrorist. I cant imagine that this list would be in such disagreement on
theses issues. Those countries are the most luddite, anti-technology,
anti-capitalist, anti-reason countries you could find. You go right ahead
and think about particular concretes and don't try to link these concretes
and understand the relationship. What is the commonality in all these
countries other then their intense hatred of America for its greatness? Why
do they hate us? Well maybe if we don't look for a reason and address it,
the problem will go away.
It also amazes me that on a list where towers/elevators to space would be
discussed, there would be the suggestion not building them because they
might be torn down or might be dangerous.
Try to break free of the concretes of the issue and deal with the overlaying
abstractions. Bin Laden needs to be dealt with, but what created him? What
mindset and philosophical viewpoint is he coming from. Ill tell you its one
that very popular here in our country and that you will find his ideas
reflected in numerous circles here ranging from the environmental/anti-man
movement, to the religions here. They all agree that the individual needs to
be placed on the alter of self-sacrifice to the masses. Both the extreme
left in this country and the extreme right believe exactly as Bin Laden,
that the individual is nothing compared to the
environment/religion/masses/cultural group. History is the battle of ideas,
and if you don't support your own system with the full belief that you are
correct, they you are going consigned to the quagmire of guilt that so many
around now seemed to be steeped in. The big enemies we should be fighting on
our front (as well as those foreign) are guilt and fear. Most of the guilt
is because we still have in this age of moon walks and supercomputers, that
we still possess the philosophy of cave men. Those that carry that
philosophy, and its a majority of people for the most part, deserve it and
the guilt.
Jerry
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