[p2p-research] Defining Altruism ? Normative vs Autonomous ? Liberal Vs Conservative ?

[Michel Bauwens]

well ryan, all I can say is that a lot of justice departments, both in the
U.S. and Europe, have thought otherwise, and that Microsoft was effectively
condemned for a number of its practices ...

the question is not that microsoft has 'not produced' but how it has
produced what it produced, how it achieved dominance, and according to many,
including in the business and political community, with people who actually
share most of your premises, that was not a pretty picture, how did it
extract the value that paid for the houses and the cars .. as kevin argues,
and I don't think Microsoft will deny as they are in favour of it, it is not
based on production, but on rent extraction, the price for production of its
software has been paid a millions time over ... or, very very
conservatively, at least 10 times, since companies using open source claim
to save about 90% of their investment costs ..

what this has to do with hating, I'm not sure I understand, I think most of
the people in the business community and the justice departments, did not
hate Bill Gates, they were either rivals at the short end of the stick, or
officials with concerns about competitivity etc... Microsoft itselt behaved
as ruthless attack dogs with competitors, which it destroyed without
compulsion, so where is the hate, and why is one kind of hate more justified
than the other,

why is a enclosing hate generating billions in rent, less reprehensible than
a passion for openness, which also generates billions, but spreads it out
more evenly ..

the movement for openness indeed saw Microsoft as the prime enemy,  not out
of any kind of atavistic hate, but from experience with its practices...

Lennon by the way, was most probably wrong, unfortunately, hate has worked
pretty well as a political force,

Michel




On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 2:28 PM, Ryan Lanham <rlanham1963 at gmail.com> wrote:

> To call Bill Gates a thief is to make a mockery of theft.  He has
> produced.  His production has built thousands of good lives, good houses,
> cars, college educations, etc.
>
> To paraphrase John Lennon...if you want support for people with minds that
> hate...all I can tell you brother is that you'll have to wait.
>
> R.
>
>
> On Tue, Jul 20, 2010 at 11:52 PM, Kevin Carson <
> free.market.anticapitalist at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 7/20/10, Ryan Lanham <rlanham1963 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > How would people explain the altruism of a Bill Gates, Warren Buffett,
>> etc.
>> > Guilt?
>> >
>> > Bill Gates has done far more for humanity than everyone on this list
>> > combined.  Yet, I suspect many here would hold him in contempt.
>>
>> My usual reaction to stories of plutocratic philanthropy is that,
>> instead of giving back part of what they extracted from society, they
>> just shouldn't steal in the first place.  I don't think it's possible
>> to become a billionaire by honest means, without some sort of rent
>> extraction with the help of the government.  Just about every penny of
>> Gates' fortune comes from the "intellectual property" rents he's
>> extracted with the help of the state.
>>
>> --
>> Kevin Carson
>> Center for a Stateless Society http://c4ss.org
>> Mutualist Blog:  Free Market Anti-Capitalism
>> http://mutualist.blogspot.com
>> The Homebrew Industrial Revolution:  A Low-Overhead Manifesto
>> http://homebrewindustrialrevolution.wordpress.com
>> Organization Theory:  A Libertarian Perspective
>> http://mutualist.blogspot.com/2005/12/studies-in-anarchist-theory-of.html
>>
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>
>
>
> --
> Ryan Lanham
> rlanham1963 at gmail.com
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