[p2p-research] What is the Origin of our Money Supply?

[Ryan Lanham]

Good discussion, I think.

Michel, I use machine because machines are understood to be about
productivity.  Anything designed for productivity is a machine.  Money is a
machine.  Brains are not designed, so I wouldn't call them machines.  They
are instead evolved.  Soon brains will be designed, but not yet.

Evolution tends to be the optimum form of choice in systems when there is no
capacity to design with productive purpose.  If you believe in intelligent
design, then yes, a brain is a machine.

Patrick, there are endless social contracts that are rented.  Police.
 Government.  Prostitutes.  They are everywhere.

Alex, the anarchists view of money is very Austrian (e.g. Hayak, Menger,
etc).  Where they tend to differ is that Austrians are moral neutral to
moral emphatic that markets make for the best social systems.  Anarchists,
as I understand it, tend to want non-market social systems to excel as
well...possibly even things like communes.

The term "fiat" is rhetorical of course.  It is meant to divide and anger
rather than to enlighten.  It's a bit like "artificial" scarcity.

All social theories from the Republic to Leviathan to Two Treatises to Das
Kapital and all those of our own century, start out with metaphysical
ideals.  They hope for some outcome.  They have proven useful to those who
must start governments afresh...like the US founders.  Very few governments
and constitutions are founded afresh...most have some historical roots of
one sort or another that cause path dependencies.  South Africa recently
wrote a brilliant constitution de novo.

Anarchists would dispense with central government.  Austrians would tend to
see central government as a minimalist project.  I am neither of these.  My
own view is that governments should be pragmatically designed to do what
people want.  If people want (consistently) socialism, then they should have
it.  Personally, I'd move out of Cuba if I had the chance to live in the
Cayman Islands instead.  So would most Cubans.

In my world, freedom is valued very high.  Governments move to aid fair
trade, free flows of goods, enforcement of contracts, and the existence of
sound money.  I doubt most of what else they do (excepting national defense)
is done with much efficiency (e.g. running schools or charities.)  But I am
OK with those.  As a pragmatist and a Keynesian, I am in favor of doing what
works best to keep things working best...what is best?  Best is value.
 Value is mostly determined by markets.  Value is what people want in terms
of culture, liberty, etc.  My political views are closest to the late 20th
century legal philosophy at Yale and Oxford--people like Ronald Dworkin.
 Others I admire are Will Kymlicka and Robert Nozick.  I also admire John
Rawls' work, but that is like saying you admire Plato.

R.




On Tue, Jul 20, 2010 at 4:35 AM, Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com>wrote:

> perhaps a naive question, but what is the advantage of using "machines" to
> describe all kinds of social processes ...
>
> why call money a 'machine'
>
> why call the mind a machine,
>
> what is gained and what is lost by this?
>
> On Tue, Jul 20, 2010 at 4:27 PM, Patrick Anderson <agnucius at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Ryan Lanham wrote:
>> > All social contracts of any sort are fiats.
>>
>> Can you name the one Social Contract that must be *rented*.
>>
>> Have you ever *rented* the use of any other type of Social Contract?
>>
>>
>> > Money is an agreement.
>>
>> But a special kind of agreement that requires compounding interest
>> (rent) be paid in perpetuity.
>>
>>
>> > 2. All contracts are machines that make value.
>>
>> Which of those 'machines' drains value from those who use it to those
>> who issued it?
>>
>> Why are all other Social Contracts 'fiat', but not debt-based?
>>
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Ryan Lanham
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P.O. Box 633
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