[p2p-research] Mesh - Not for profit Cooperative + "Megabytes" Currency

[Alex Rollin]

Since you started this conversation by email, will you be re-wikifying what
you have learned somewhere?  Perhaps back on share wiki?

Perhaps some section...

Hardware
Software
Business Models/Motivations
Collaboration Systems (Currency)
Current Systems (how they differ from what you propose, advantages
disadvantages.)

On Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 5:18 PM, Dante-Gabryell Monson <
dante.monson at gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> On Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 2:29 PM, Alex Rollin <alex.rollin at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> This brings up an interesting conundrum.
>>
>> If you say to people "There's a mesh network!  It's free!"
>>
>> They say "Free Internet!  Yes!"
>>
>> And you say "No!  It's an intranet, with strangers!"
>>
>> And they say "...oh...what do you use that for?"
>>
>> What would your answer be?
>>
>
> "you can call your family and friends for free if they are at the other
> side of town, connected to the mesh"
>
>
>>
>> As long as there is no plan for economic or other agreed upon interaction
>> with node hosts there are no guarantees of net access,
>>
>
> indeed, good point, no guarantees.
>
> I do not have an engineer background for technical details and its
> feasibility,
> but in the way that I conceptualize it,
>
> I imagine that for participants providing shared internet to the mesh,
> they can access their own connection ( or equivalent in data flow / via the
> "currency" approach ) via the mesh.
>
> so that even if there is only one internet contributor to the mesh,
> then this one contributor is the only one having access to hes own
> connection, via the mesh,
> except for the percentage of the volume of dataflow s/he shares from he's
> her internet connection that is given to the network promoters, who
> potentially could sell ( or not ? ) a few of these megabytes to some other
> user, as to support the network financially - for the promotion of the
> network.
>
>
> or the long term presence of the node itself.  They need power, shelter,
>> the usual things an off-the-shelf robot needs.
>>
>
> yes - i imagine there could be a "backbone" of nodes owned by the project,
> and other nodes being participants, hence the network being emergent,
> including mobile nodes ( manet protocols ? compatibilty with other
> protocols ? bridges possible ? )
>
>
>>
>> Freethenet's original model was to subsidize the node hardware for a
>> business making a commitment to share an uplink with the public, within
>> reasonable limits, for a duration.  In some cases the business would pay for
>> it themselves, and those businesses got installed first.  The point was to
>> increase traffic.  The business were enticed with advertising, but, in
>> effect, it was a decision about whether they wanted people loitering with
>> laptops.
>>
>
> I guess the business model I imagine with the examples shared earlier are
> probably a bit different - hopefully not as hierarchical, and not dependent
> on specific providers -
>
> yet still dependent on a threshold density of users/participants
>
>
>>
>> The main library in Amsterdam has recently removed power connections from
>> the 7th floor, where the most comfortable couches are, and where the beer
>> is.  It was a veyr busy spot.  They screwed the power connection covers
>> shut.
>>
>> A
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 2:22 PM, Dante-Gabryell Monson <
>> dante at ecobytes.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Alex,
>>>
>>> thanks for your 11 points reply.
>>>
>>> http://freethenet.ca/ sounds like a nice model.
>>>
>>> ---
>>>
>>> I wonder if the first step could be to
>>>
>>> - evaluate the costs of setting up a few nodes/routers in a limited area
>>> - without necessarily connecting them to the internet.
>>>
>>> - making it possible to anyone finding such nodes,
>>> to download a software from these nodes on their devices ( options for
>>> various OS ),
>>> as
>>> 1) enable their laptop/phone to be a participating node in the mesh when
>>> they choose to
>>> 2) giving them the option of sharing their internet, directly through the
>>> wifi connection of their laptop/phone/...
>>>
>>> - I do not know *if such software already exists* -
>>>
>>> a later stage potentially being for people to modify the protocols of
>>> their routers, or buy routers that are compliant with one/several
>>> communication protocols ?
>>>
>>> ---
>>>
>>> for hardware , software, prices and protocols used,
>>> openmesh hardware sounds nice.
>>>
>>> its nice to see *what is already available out of the box, and at what
>>> price*.
>>>
>>> i do like the idea of being able to update and add multiple protocols,
>>> even at a distance. ( although cracking concerns may be taken into account )
>>> i also like the potential of using "batman" and "robin"
>>> i guess all this is possible providing the expertise.
>>>
>>> ---
>>>
>>> *if cash is not involved* in exchange for internet data currency,
>>>
>>> the question for me becomes : *how to self-finance some of the (
>>> purchase of ) nodes* needed to keep a minimum permanent presence,
>>> especially in areas where there are few participants, as to bridge zones
>>> with different levels of mesh density ?
>>>
>>> / *what is the "cash" version of the "business model"* ,
>>> even if it is a not for profit approach - which could partner with
>>> existing not for profit mesh projects.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Forwarded conversation
>>> Subject: Mesh - Not for profit Cooperative + "Megabytes" Currency
>>> ------------------------
>>>
>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante at ecobytes.net>
>>> Date: Sat, Jul 17, 2010 at 4:52 PM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Alex,
>>> Caroline, Sepp, Meinhard, Gael
>>>
>>> I ( we**? ) want to set up a Mesh Cooperative.
>>>
>>> I created an entry on
>>>
>>> http://cashwiki.org/en/A_Mesh_Data_Currency
>>>
>>> ---
>>>
>>> In addition to the set up and interoperability of the communication
>>> protocols,
>>> it can use an "alternative currency" for accessing the internet. ( its
>>> units / megabytes / can also be used as currency for any other type of
>>> exchanges )
>>>
>>> Ideally it creates partnerships between all participants, credits earned
>>> by the network preferably reinvested into valorizing the network while
>>> promoting open source hardware.
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *It works like this :*
>>>
>>> People use their wifi router ( check hardware + software, and
>>> interoperability ),
>>> their wifi enabled pc or laptop, or their wifi enabled mobile phones,
>>> to enable ad hoc networking,
>>> becoming relay's.
>>>
>>> As they participate in the network, they have access to the network.
>>>
>>> As they provide bandwidth to the local network, they have access to
>>> bandwidth in the local network BUT they give a certain percentage more of
>>> what they receive to the network,
>>>
>>> which makes it possible to the network to "sell" credits to non
>>> contributing people wanting to access the internet.
>>>
>>> Thats the business model.
>>>
>>> The extra cash is being spent in a not for profit to promote the network,
>>> create partnerships ( with national libraries, universities, schools,
>>> businesses )
>>> increase its usership,
>>> and set up critical nodes in places where the density of existing users
>>> is not high enough.
>>>
>>> It can be a combination of MANET ( Mobile Ad Hoc Networks ) and Fixed
>>> routers.
>>>
>>> Two existing , different projects :
>>>
>>> http://meraki.com/
>>>
>>> http://www.fon.com/en/
>>>
>>>
>>> ---
>>>
>>> Mesh Networking :
>>>
>>>  <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesh_networking>
>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesh_networking
>>>
>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_ad_hoc_network
>>>
>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ad-hoc_routing_protocols
>>>
>>>
>>> Also see some of the posts on
>>>
>>> http://p2pfoundation.ning.com/forum/topics/could-peernet-be-separate-from
>>>
>>> including Sepp's post
>>>
>>> http://p2pfoundation.ning.com/forum/topics/mesh-potato-how-to-roll-out
>>>
>>> http://p2pfoundation.ning.com/forum/topics/project-spiderweb-a
>>>
>>> http://p2pfoundation.ning.com/forum/topics/evernote-cloud-app-for-mobile
>>>
>>>
>>> More links :
>>>
>>> http://delicious.com/deliciousdante/mesh
>>>
>>> and related
>>>
>>> http://delicious.com/deliciousdante/adhoc
>>>
>>>
>>> ----
>>>
>>> **Its an old idea I have been thinking about since I interacted with
>>> reseaucitoyen.be some 8 years ago,
>>>  and set up back to date through interacting with Gael.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------
>>> From: *Alex Rollin* <alex.rollin at gmail.com>
>>> Date: Sat, Jul 17, 2010 at 6:00 PM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> An wxcellent example of all the concepts we have been discussing.  I will
>>> review your links.
>>>
>>> I deployed a Meraki mesh net in the early days of the product.  It was
>>> not easy and that was with a simple protocol ( ie sans currency.)  i hope
>>> research will tell me the situation has improved.
>>>
>>> Indeed the mesh net entry on the p2p wiki referenced a lean network,
>>> g-something, that looked quite on top of things.
>>>
>>> Alex
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------
>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante at ecobytes.net>
>>> Date: Sat, Jul 17, 2010 at 6:28 PM
>>> To: Alex Rollin <alex.rollin at gmail.com>
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> oh cool !
>>>
>>> I guess you mean... hmm... scanning through the following pages... ( see
>>> below )
>>>
>>> and updated the wiki page :
>>> ----
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>    - Mesh Networks <http://Mesh_Networks>
>>>    ... ogy' of the network. There are a number of routing protocols
>>>    which support meshnetworking amongst which [[OLSR]] is one of the
>>>    most advanced and most wid ... ... nections. It is the lack of a
>>>    hub-and-spoke structure that distinguishes a meshnetwork. Meshes do
>>>    not need designated routers: instead, nodes serve as ro ...
>>>    15 KB (2345 words) - 08:04, 13 May 2009
>>>    - Wireless Mesh Networks <http://Wireless_Mesh_Networks>
>>>    '''Wireless Mesh Networks''', '''Wireless mesh networking is mesh networking
>>>    implemented over a Wireless LAN.'''
>>>    5 KB (812 words) - 11:06, 10 March 2008
>>>    - Wi-Mesh Alliance <http://Wi-Mesh_Alliance>
>>>    '''Wi-Mesh Alliance''' URL = http://www.wi-mesh.org/
>>>    654 B (95 words) - 09:52, 26 May 2006
>>>    - Marc Canter on Mesh Networks for Content<http://Marc_Canter_on_Mesh_Networks_for_Content>
>>>    '''Title: Mesh-Up: Connecting Conent to People''' Written summary at
>>>    http://www.nmk.co.uk/article/2006/07/25/content20-the-mesh
>>>    415 B (56 words) - 08:49, 25 August 2006
>>>    - P2P Mesh Networks <http://P2P_Mesh_Networks>
>>>    ... device to their in home network connection that offers free
>>>    access to the meshnetwork and simultaneously extends the network. Not
>>>    all participants choo ...
>>>    1 KB (180 words) - 23:00, 8 July 2010
>>>    - Open Mesh <http://Open_Mesh>
>>>    ... rk Canter has an extensive investigation of what we need to build
>>>    the open mesh: 1) [
>>>    http://blog.broadbandmechanics.com/2008/03/how-to-build-the-mesh-1-id-social-graphs-and-groups
>>>    Layer One], [[Identity]], [[Data Portability ...
>>>    10 KB (1526 words) - 04:19, 17 August 2008
>>>    - Meraki Mesh Networks <http://Meraki_Mesh_Networks>
>>>    ... ipal wi-fi projects'''." [
>>>    http://www.boingboing.net/2008/01/10/meraki-free-mesh-wif.html] "In
>>>    most mesh networks, all the nodes that receive a particular data
>>>    packet
>>>    8 KB (1288 words) - 20:03, 11 March 2008
>>>    - Open Mesh Networks <http://Open_Mesh_Networks>
>>>    ==Why Open Mesh Networks are beneficial== ... ion, expands the
>>>    capacity of the network. This intelligence is the key to mesh networks’
>>>    immense capacity.
>>>    2 KB (336 words) - 12:51, 28 December 2007
>>>    - Open Source Mesh <http://Open_Source_Mesh>
>>>    '''= community in favor of [[Open Source Mesh Networking]]''' ... rld
>>>    now have a place to collaborate to create a suite of tools to liberate
>>>    Mesh networks from proprietary solutions and vendors who's business
>>>    models focu ...
>>>    1 KB (163 words) - 04:33, 17 August 2008
>>>    - Open Source Mesh Networking <http://Open_Source_Mesh_Networking>
>>>    #[[Open Source Mesh]] #[[Meraki Mesh Networks]]
>>>    134 B (14 words) - 05:10, 2 February 2008
>>>    - Open Mesh Routing Protocols <http://Open_Mesh_Routing_Protocols>
>>>    121 B (13 words) - 05:30, 2 February 2008
>>>    - Marc Canter on the Structural Conditions for Building an Open Mesh<http://Marc_Canter_on_the_Structural_Conditions_for_Building_an_Open_Mesh>
>>>    ... rk Canter has an extensive investigation of what we need to build
>>>    the open mesh: 1) [
>>>    http://blog.broadbandmechanics.com/2008/03/how-to-build-the-mesh-1-id-social-graphs-and-groups
>>>    Layer One], [[Identity]], [[Data Portability ...
>>>    6 KB (933 words) - 05:39, 8 July 2008
>>>    - World Wide Mesh <http://World_Wide_Mesh>
>>>    ... o each other via the Internet these meshes come together in one
>>>    world-widemesh. ... m the network-centric model to the peer-to-peer
>>>    model, enabled by wireless mesh technology."
>>>    603 B (77 words) - 02:37, 17 February 2010
>>>    - Mesh Potato <http://Mesh_Potato>
>>>    URL = http://www.villagetelco.org/mesh-potato/mesh-potato-faq/ ... a
>>>    marriage of a low-cost wireless access point ( AP) capable of running a
>>>    mesh networking protocol with an Analog Telephony Adapter ( ATA).
>>>    Wireless AP ...
>>>    1 KB (142 words) - 15:55, 28 May 2010
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------
>>> From: *Sepp Hasslberger* <sepp at lastrega.com>
>>> Date: Sun, Jul 18, 2010 at 8:58 PM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Dante,
>>>
>>> this seems a good initiative, but I have one question: What is the
>>> selling point?
>>>
>>> In other words, what does the currency you propose add to people's
>>> willingness to network and to share.
>>>
>>> In my view, many users would be happy to get into a sharing and
>>> networking mode, but they aren't there yet. What they are missing is not so
>>> much an incentive (a currency) but an opportunity. There is no easily
>>> available hardware, and more often than not, there is no one to network
>>> with. So how can that scarcity of opportunity be overcome?
>>>
>>> Kind regards
>>> Sepp
>>>
>>> p.s. added a cc to Michel, who would no doubt also be interested.
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------
>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante at ecobytes.net>
>>> Date: Sun, Jul 18, 2010 at 9:11 PM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks Sepp.
>>>
>>> Good point.
>>> Yes, I have been reading many of your posts on this subject, and I
>>> remember we may have discussed the topic of meshed networks already.
>>>
>>> The selling point I believe is not the currency per se,
>>> but the possibility for people to access local and internet communication
>>> beyond their own wifi access point, for no additional cost,
>>> except for a configuration of their router, or wifi enabled mobile phone.
>>>
>>> more precisely, it can offer them access to :
>>>
>>> 1) a distributed local mesh, which enables them to share files or *communicate
>>> locally*,
>>> potentially *also through voice over ip, for free*.
>>> note : As more and more people are likely to have wifi enabled phones,
>>> and as such phones are more and more like little computers, I imagine
>>> they themselves may become a manet ( mobile ) node in the mesh.
>>>
>>> 2) *have access to the internet in more places* in their neighbourhood
>>> and city,
>>>  *if they themselves provide internet bandwidth to the mesh*
>>>
>>> the currency in itself probably being only coming in third position,
>>> as an additional option.
>>>
>>> ----------
>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante at ecobytes.net>
>>> Date: Sun, Jul 18, 2010 at 9:14 PM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> and a fourth , omportant one for me,
>>> one may be a sense of increased local autonomy,
>>> of a bound between people in your neighborhood that is not dependent on
>>> companies anymore,
>>> and potentially even of "identity" ... ? :-)
>>>
>>> ----------
>>> From: *Sepp Hasslberger* <sepp at lastrega.com>
>>> Date: Sun, Jul 18, 2010 at 10:48 PM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Dante,
>>>
>>> what you are saying is actually the business model of FON. You install
>>> one of their low-cost wireless modems permitting other "foneros" who happen
>>> to be close by, to use your connection via WiFi, and in exchange you get to
>>> use the connections of others who also have installed a "la fonera" FON
>>> modem. They are making those wireless modems available at a low price, but
>>> the technology is not as advanced as it should be. The reach is definitely
>>> too short to be really useful, and the FON wireless access points don't make
>>> a network, they don't talk to each other. The model of FON is sharing your
>>> connection and getting access in a similar way from others.
>>>
>>> Meraki, I believe, is different, in that their modems actually do form an
>>> ad-hoc network by talking to each other. They are also using cheap wireless
>>> modems that extend, to some degree, the area of coverage of one or more
>>> single "real" internet connections to a group of users. Meraki is
>>> commercial, just like FON. They were trying to roll out a network over San
>>> Francisco, but have scaled back their expectations, I believe. None of those
>>> two have really had a great growth or a breakthrough.
>>>
>>> There is also an open source Meraki, so to speak, which is, I believe,
>>> called Open Mesh. If I remember correctly, they concentrate on B.A.T.M.A.N.
>>> which is a routing protocol that allows mesh networks to form. They work by
>>> changing the flash memory of certain compatible commercially available
>>> routers.
>>>
>>> The big problem, for now, seems to be the lack of a proper hardware
>>> platform to base the network on, that is widely available. That would be the
>>> thing to concentrate on. Meraki and FON have hardware, but their drawback is
>>> lack of wide reach (WiFi goes only about 30 meters distance in good
>>> conditions, less if you have walls to contend with), and the fact that they
>>> are commercial, meaning they would like to have the whole world converge on
>>> themselves, and it doesn't seem to work that way.
>>>
>>> Until we have proper hardware to ensure connectivity, that is widely
>>> available and that is open to be configured like we want, there is really no
>>> way people will jump unto the mesh networking scene, if only because there
>>> is a lack of opportunity, i.e. they don't know HOW to do it.
>>>
>>> Kind regards
>>> Sepp
>>>
>>> ----------
>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante at ecobytes.net>
>>> Date: Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 12:29 AM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Exactly Sepp!
>>> A mixture of meraki and fon approaches, although I Ideally imagine that
>>> people could configure their own routers
>>> (if they can add protocols , such as with a linksys router, or unless
>>> partnerships are created with various existing internet providers who offer
>>> a router with their service as to add a mesh protocol)
>>>
>>> Or if they can add a module that easily turns their mobile phone or
>>> laptop into a mobile relay node.
>>>
>>> Easiest would be to start experimenting on university campuses, including
>>> by enabling the meshed laptops and phones to share files ,potentially using
>>> bittorrent over mesh? With a high density,I wonder if it reduces bottlenecks
>>> and increases file sharing speeds? At the same time increasing the quality
>>> of the reach of connectivity over a campus.
>>>
>>> I guess this is where is connects with the one laptop per child project.
>>>
>>> It could also be used by students to enable shared processing power of
>>> their devices,over mesh,to support some of their projects. (especially for
>>> hungry for processing tasks? Video editing? )
>>>
>>> Eventually processing power over mesh could also warn credits?
>>>
>>> Just brainstorming as I m walking back and writing on my phone...
>>>
>>> What motivates me most,personally,is to have an.emergent autonomous local
>>> mesh,which can guarantee autonomy of control from governments and internet
>>> providers for local data exchanges,and serve as backbone for local
>>> information systems that support local economics.
>>>
>>> Perhaps there can be a mobile mesh protocol that can be proposed to run
>>> with various mobile applications.
>>>
>>> Perhaps that one way of doing it,in a granular and emergent way... ?
>>>
>>> In that case,where does one start?
>>>
>>> Using open hardware and old pc' to contribute to existing meshes, and
>>> find existing tools to easily enable compatibility between Batman and mobile
>>> mesh protocols,
>>>
>>> Using an easy to install module for android and iPhone's?
>>>
>>> ...
>>>
>>> I guess its still a dream...
>>> Perhaps the time is not ripe yet?
>>>
>>> Still need to wait till 10 dollar open hardware ,with wifi and pre
>>> installed (and configurable) open source software enabling mesh protocols?
>>>
>>> Or is the current 30 to 50 dollar node making it viable in high density
>>> areas,especially if some form of revenue can be created?
>>>
>>> Just thinking loud up late at night ,after a small sip :)
>>>
>>> Perhaps easiest to start by investing in our own mesh of routers...
>>> starting with the meraki approach... building on existing communities of
>>> local mesh enthusiasts...
>>>
>>> Hi Dante,
>>>
>>> > Yes, I h...
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------
>>> From: *Alex Rollin* <alex.rollin at gmail.com>
>>> Date: Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 6:50 AM
>>> Peer-To-Peer Research List <p2presearch at listcultures.org>
>>>
>>>
>>> A couple points:
>>>
>>>
>>>    1. The connections to the internet are not *free* because "access
>>>    points" are assumed to be connected to the www, which requires someone to
>>>    pay.
>>>    2. The currency might be great for enabling those who offer an
>>>    "access point" credit for use on other "access points"
>>>    3. Most "organized" mesh nets do not encourage a charge of any kind
>>>    for roaming users.  Example: http://guifi.net/directori .  This might
>>>    just be a new class of networks, though.  See FreeTheNet below, which does
>>>    charge as a cooperative.
>>>    4. An alternative currency for access is great, and innovative, but
>>>    exchanging that currency for "cash" may not be desirable as it is not
>>>    standard procedure for mesh nets.  Good idea, though.  It needs to be a
>>>    platform, though.  A platform should be usable, copyable, and extendable.
>>>     Hypothetically, extensions should be usable by others on the platform
>>>    copies.  Walk away complete is the tag line.
>>>    5. Most protocols that happen over the internet can happen between
>>>    machines and a configuration package for local services discovery could be
>>>    very interesting.  Usually local networks are useless except for file
>>>    sharing, and the services are less than ideal in many cases.
>>>    6. The local package for service discovery could be handled/built in
>>>    a way that was "network ambivalant", as a package that worked on the
>>>    internet or a local network.  Example: keeping a list of media files you are
>>>    looking for and using a collection of programs that search here or there to
>>>    find you sources.
>>>    7. OLPC already does mesh networking in a way significantly similar
>>>    to what you describe http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Mesh_Network_Details .
>>>     This is not typical for the configuration of wireless network cards in
>>>    machines, though it is possible (for some part, at least)
>>>    8. The Meraki company made a mistake and raised the price of their
>>>    hardware so Open-Mesh took over the "higher purpose" of providing BATMAN and
>>>    ROBIN pre-flashed nodes and extenders
>>>    https://www.open-mesh.com/store/categories.php?category=Lowest%252dCost-Mesh .  FreeTheNet uses Accton routers from OpenMesh, see below.
>>>    9. Changing settings to allow and encourage local services discovery
>>>    can be dangerous.  As a networking professional I will say that 95% of
>>>    people are using default settings on their machine, and these make it almost
>>>    impossible to easily discover local services with changing configurations,
>>>    and that is potentially dangerous.  No more dangerous than using the
>>>    internet, I suppose, but the exploits don't come through the browser,
>>>    necessarily.  See the wifi iphone hack.  The issue is perhaps only different
>>>    in that local network bandwidth is much higher, and so a hole in security
>>>    can be exploited very quickly with big packages.
>>>    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/23/technology/23iphone.html
>>>    10. You don't need to do anything new to accomplish your vision of
>>>    extending the range of a local network across your city.  Just copy what
>>>    http://guifi.net/directori is doing and use Open-Mesh routers.  It's
>>>    getting easier, apparently.  I worked on http://freethenet.ca/ in
>>>    2007 when it was just some guys hacking hardware and figuring out the
>>>    business model.  It was a pain because the first Meraki products were just
>>>    coming out and the team had to write and rewrite the code for the
>>>    coordinated uplink, which allowed the routers to be flashed remotely.  Now
>>>    it's a coop.  Yay!  So you can copy them too!  Check out their bylaws here:
>>>    http://www.vonic.ca/about FreeTheNet and Vonic use a custom
>>>    DogOnRails app for network management, under development in a different form
>>>    during my time.  This is for tracking memberships, I am sure, over the
>>>    network and between access points.  It's also needed because the FreeTheNet
>>>    model through Vonic calls for underwriting extending mesh deep into
>>>    residential areas to supply home connections over a shared network.  A
>>>    special purpose monitoring and optimization software is useful for that kind
>>>    of thing.
>>>    11. You won't escape governance and I don't know how to conceive of a
>>>    local mesh in such a way.  It still uses hardware made by the machine, and
>>>    it still has to connect to the www, at least for now, through ISP
>>>    connections.  Someone has to pay for that.  Using local mesh for file
>>>    traffic several limits what files are available.  It would take a small city
>>>    to duplicate the power of a Google server farm used to cache partial copies
>>>    of the internet, and that farm would be optimized for the task, unlike a
>>>    city-res-mesh.
>>>
>>> Alex
>>> http://alexrollin.com
>>> http://p2pfoundation.net/User:GoodRollin
>>>
>>> ----------
>>> From: *Gael Van Weyenbergh* <stroombank at gmail.com>
>>> Date: Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 1:45 PM
>>> To: Alex Rollin <alex.rollin at gmail.com>
>>> Peer-To-Peer Research List <p2presearch at listcultures.org>
>>>
>>>
>>> The simplest way I see this is to apply the couch surfing model to the
>>> sharing of internet connections. Then there is maybe no need for a currency
>>> and the risk of abuse can be reduced by mutual good practices as
>>> participating members are equally vulnerable. In fact, my underlying concern
>>> is to avoid being totally dependent on regular ISPs. The development of a
>>> parallel mesh of interconnected mobile devices sounds more appealing. It
>>> could be used at a city-level for file sharing, grid computing or as a place
>>> where needs can match offers with the exchange of community currencies.
>>>
>>> Gael
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
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