[p2p-research] Repurposing Profit for User Freedom

[Michel Bauwens]

On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 10:39 PM, Ryan Lanham <rlanham1963 at gmail.com> wrote:

>  On 2/5/10, Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> I'm not sure where these ideas are that have always failed. I have heard
>> from many different people that my record of predicting trends has been
>> pretty accurate (of course I do make mistakes and I am constantly adjusting
>> my expectations to observable facts.
>>
>
>
> I am saying that the ideas that fail are socialism and communism of the
> coercive sort.  I agree that you have been quite prescient about the
> evolution of the system.
>

but I am never arguing for that, so I find it strange that you always bring
that up ...


>
>> Denying that almost any sector of our mainstream economy are run by
>> dominant monopolies would demand pretty strong blindfolds, but indeed they
>> are being undermined by the new p2p economy, and not by capitalism itself
>> which has been a monopolistic system probably from the beginning of the
>> century. The whole system is stacked in favour of big players.
>>
>>
>
> I guess I have pretty strong blindfolds.  I see no monopolies.  I see
> desparate hopes for momentary control.  It is indeed the exact oppositive.
> It is the instability of profit that is the issue...not the guarantee of
> it.  Capitallsm isn't failing because it is corrupt and torpid, it is
> failing because it is hypercompetitive and evolving too fast.
>


It is failing, because it can no longer protect its monopolies, because the
new technology does not really allow the tight control on information flows
and copying that it could rely on to do this; Buffet said it himself very
clearly: free competition kills profits, so the game of capital is to create
temporary monopolies (in theory), and in practice, permanent  or very long
lasting monopolies, with each industrial sector, through incessant mergers
and acquisitions, converging on 2-3 dominant players; the concentration of
capital has been extraordinarily intensive since the 80s




>
>
>>
>> It is strange that you say that free and p2p are winning all over, yet you
>> are opposed to communal property. But this is exactly what open knowledge,
>> free software code and shared designs are, as clearly defined by their very
>> licenses! But you probably mean that you oppose coops then, i.e. communal
>> property in the physical world? (and please note that public state property
>> is NOT communal property). Fair enough, I like coops and they have a very
>> good record, they are the largest employer of the world, bigger than all the
>> multinationals combined. Yes, I admit it, I prefer, for many reasons,
>> distributed property above oligarchic exclusive property that is based on
>> massive expropriation.
>>
>> Michel
>>
>>
>
> I am completely not opposed to communal property.  I am a greater advocate
> for it than any socialist.  I am for free participation in open and
> voluntary systems.  I am for co-ops.  I advocate for them regularly.  I have
> worked for one.  Co-ops do have a great record.  They work well.  But you
> must not be forced to join a co-op.  At that point they become the failed
> past.  Coercion is everything.  If you coerce, you destroy incentive.  The
> incentive must be to share and be communal.  If you force it, you destroy
> it.
>


well, then we agree <g>


>
>
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