[p2p-research] text as code

[Michel Bauwens]

see inline

On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 9:00 PM, M. Fioretti <marco at digifreedom.net> wrote:

> On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 19:29:59 PM +0700, Michel Bauwens (
> michelsub2004 at gmail.com) wrote:
>
> > You would still have to look down on the immense majoirity of the
> > human population.
>
> Sorry, no.  Those who look down on people who can't or don't like to
> code are RMS, the Free SW Foundation and everybody else thinking in
> that way. My work and much of my writings go exactly in the opposite
> direction.
>

HI Marco,

I have no specific experience in FSF looking down on non-technical users,
though it may be.

You are of course correct that a certain technological literacy is a
required literacy, but there is still a question of how much. I have used to
wiki over four years, created 13,000 pages that I think are coherently
organized, and have been consultted 13 million times. I have done this with
a basic knowledge of wiki code, which I have learned on the go and asked for
advice when I had difficulties. Now however,  I would have to constantly
check the manual, and test code and content across multiple pages and
categories, and it is hard to see the content amidst a plethora of code,
most of which does not represent any expressed need, but an idealized
technocratic vision of how we should be using the wiki.

Quite apart from my personal failings in wanting to learn more wiki code,
this is a separate information architectural issue.

It is also true that technological literacy is quite an endless and
limitless path, where does anyone stop? Maybe I could extend my scope, which
I slowly but surely do, but perhaps not as fast of a much that a
technically  oriented person would like. You have to take into account human
diversity, quirks and failings. I literally hate math and code, I'm not
proud of that, but it is something I have to battle with everyday. But I'm
also still learning everyday. Could you not agree Marco, that even if James
has to install the wiki, the capacity to publish a wiki/blog, a tagging
network, does at least represent some willingness to learn?

I ask for help when I need to, sometimes that help is forthcoming, sometimes
not, and I'm willing to pay the price for that. No matter how much I learn,
there will always be limitations, there will always be a need of technical
help. I could extend myh literacy and move the boundary, but it would change
the fundamental condition that there is a need for technical specialization
which not everybody can have.

The issue with Alex is different. It is not about a enlightened coder and a
stupid user who doesn't want to learn. It is about code as power. Alex has a
vision, and think it is the only legitimate one, and cannot understand that
anyone would dispute his enlightened insights. In the process, he creates
the difficulties I have described. I am opposed to the text as code vision
not just because of these personal difficulties however, but also
politically, I consider it legitimate, but profoundly erroneous and
anti-humanistic. It's a power grab by technocratically inclined people, and
the whole of the behaviour I have witnessed is for me witness and proof that
it was about power. A power that brokes no dissent, that privileges the
techno-savvy, and that doesn't consider the possibilty of alternatives. This
is in fine, what this conflict has been about.

Please note, i have no problem with competing visions per se, but they have
to be expressed in a way that respect the rights of others and this was not
the case, my concerns were brushed aside, not once, but systematically.

My analysis is that some people can ony see themselves, albeit
unconsciously, as superior to others, and this game was played on me
repeatedly to the point it became insufferable.

You also write, see just below, marco, my remark was not specifically
directed at you, I had indeed seen that you had agreed to that other point I
had made

sorry if I did not make that clear

> I'm really surprised at people who... are fans of non-contextualized
> content creation

? Have you realized that I said exactly the opposite in my previous
post, agreeing that if this is what is happening in this specific case
you're right to dislike it and to ask that it stops?



>
> I do NOT look down etc etc . I have only explicitly, specifically said
> that what is perfectly acceptable and without consequences for the
> average Internet user who makes one Wikipedia entry per year or one
> short blog post per month or some short chat on Facebook, sooner or
> later becomes an handicap for that one in 10000 person who wants/needs
> to do the specific heavy work you do 24/7. And added that in general
> it may be in YOUR interest, because of YOUR specific profession and
> needs, to do something about it, both to save yourself from future
> stress and to become much more productive in the long run.
>
> > I'm really surprised at people who... are fans of non-contextualized
> > content creation
>
> ? Have you realized that I said exactly the opposite in my previous
> post, agreeing that if this is what is happening in this specific case
> you're right to dislike it and to ask that it stops?
>
> Marco
>
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