[p2p-research] against human rentals

[Patrick Anderson]

Josef Davies-Coates wrote:
> Patrick Anderson wrote:
>> Profit is *undefined* when the Consumer
>> is also the Owner.
>>
>> There can be no difference between
>> Price and Cost in that case because
>> the product is not being purchased.
>
>
> Er, no.
>
> Take the example of The Co-operative Group
> in the UK.
>
> They are technically owned by the Consumers.

I guess by 'technically' you mean 'not'.

Sorry, but these Co-operatives are not doing
what i describe.

Consider a small group that owns a small
dairy.

You'll need to keep the sizes small during this
mental exercise because we have been programmed
to believe larger groups *MUST* be governed in a
representative manner even though that is not true.

Imagine the number of members just 2 people
if you must.

Now, when the milk is taken from the cattle and
stored in the refrigerator, *who* is the owner of
that product?

Will each of the owners be required to *buy* the
milk from the collective as a whole, or will they
just split it up according to how much ownership
they each have in the dairy?

If there were just two people, will they each be
required to pay into some strange pool that they
will then pay themselves again?

Does this change at 3 people?  4, 5, 10, 20, 100, 1000?


> Profits are re-distributed to members

That is what those cooperatives are ignorantly
doing, but that is not what I am describing.

This is a result of a poor arrangement where
the owners have to buy the product back from
themselves!  What a bunch of fools!

Those extra transactions are also targets for the
containing governments to punish them with sales
tax and open them to scrutiny as to whether they
should be allowed to sell something as dangerous
as raw milk, whereas what I describe side-steps
these issues altogether.


> Consumer Co-ops are the solutions to your
> problems Patrick.

Er, no.

Cooperatives are definitely not what we need to
move forward to a world of freedom and diversity.

Profit can safely and fully eliminated when the
consumers are *real* co-owners in the means
of production, and not until then.