[p2p-research] Concerning wikiworld and its use of socialist terminology

Fri Apr 30 10:41:05 CEST 2010

Hi, I've recently joined the list, partly because I'm interested in
thinking about P2P and other aspects of online sharing in terms of 'the
idea of communism'.

Having seen the C word used in Michel and Daniel's discussion below, I
thought I'd offer a few recent references and ask you for any further
references on (re-)asserting the idea of communism.

I'm specifically trying to get a sense of what theorists are asserting
as communism and how developments in Open Education may or may not be
positioned within this discussion, but am interested in arguments for
and against the idea of communism, today, in all aspects of life.

Thanks
Joss

Negri, Antonio & Guattari, Felix (1990) Communists like us.
Semiotext(e), New York.

Barbrook, Richard (2000) CYBER-COMMUNISM: How the Americans are
Superseding Capitalism in Cyberspace. Science as Culture, Vol. 9, Issue
1, p. 5 - 40
http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/content~db=all?content=10.1080/095054300114314

Badiou, Alan (2008) The Communist Hypothesis. New Left Review Vol. 49,
29-42.
http://www.newleftreview.org/?view=2705

Hardt, Michael (2008) The Common in Communism.
http://seminaire.samizdat.net/The-Common-in-Communism.html

On the Idea of Communism, conference at Brikbeck College, University of
London (2009) See notes and responses linked from:
http://www.bbk.ac.uk/bih/activities/ideaofcommunism
Guardian Newspaper review:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/mar/12/philosophy

Ali, Tariq (2009) The Idea of Communism. University of Chicago Press.

Zizek, Slavoj (2009) First as tragedy, then as farce. Verso, London.

Swyngedouw, Erik (2010) The Communist Hypothesis and Revolutionary
Capitalisms: Exploring the Idea of Communist Geographies for the
Twenty-first Century. Antipode Vol. 41, 298-319.
http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/123329969/abstract

Cunningham, John (2010) Invisible Politics - An Introduction to
Contemporary Communisation. Mute Magazine.
http://www.metamute.org/node/12806

Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2010 12:33:59 -0500 From: Ryan Lanham
<rlanham1963 at gmail.com> Subject: Re: [p2p-research] Concerning wikiworld
and its use of socialist terminology To: p2p research network
<p2presearch at listcultures.org> Message-ID:
<y2t9134ad231004291033uffe01c43lab24c8bf933cf88e at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Michel, I must say I
sympathize deeply with the tone Daniel is using. Ryan On Wed, Apr 28,
2010 at 10:36 PM, Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com>wrote:
> > Hi Tere,
> >
> > this is from a little dialogue on facebook,
> >
> > perhaps you want to say something about your future vision and your
choice
> > of terminology?
> >
> > couldn't find the beginning of the discussion, but you'll get the drift
> >
> > Michel
> >
> >
> >  *Daniel Araya* <http://www.facebook.com/dezuanni>* *April 28 at 11:45pm
> >  Michel. New models are always appreciated even if they borrow from
> > 'communism'. But a direct application-- its silly.
> >
> > Why do you continue to deny the wealth generated by capitalism and wax
> > poetic about an abstract communism that exists no where. Have you
read Don
> > Quixote?
> >    <http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens>
> >  *Michel Bauwens* <http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens>* *April 29 at
12:07am
> >
> >  Daniel: I gather neither you nor me actually read the book, so what are
> > we talking about. As for me, I'm only talking about the real observable,
> > already existing thing: the peer to peer dynamics online, and the
commons of
> > the physical world, not of which are abstract. So I'm wondering what
you are
> > referring to?
> >    <http://www.facebook.com/dezuanni>
> >  *Daniel Araya* <http://www.facebook.com/dezuanni>* *April 29 at 12:12am
> >  I'm talking about confusing p2p with communism. One is an emergent form
> > (growing out of the real capacities of networks--- collective
intelligence).
> > The other is a romantic vision for a secular paradise of worker
coops. They
> > may be parallel but in my mind they're not the same.
> >
> > Don't be offended. Just reacting to the liberal use of the word
'communism'
> > in that wikiworld book.
> >    <http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens>
> >  *Michel Bauwens* <http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens>* *April 29 at
9:48am
> >  technically, p2p as a social mode is what alan page fiske calls
communcal
> > chareholding, i.e. exchange with a totality, it is not related to
workers
> > coop, which is currently just a different market modality, unless there
> > would not be work for money exchange in the coop. as far as I can
see Tere's
> > is asking is how do we get from p2p in the immaterial world, to a
system of
> > worker coops. If that is your usage of communism (in old marxist
terms, this
> > is what technically would rather be socialism, i.e. the intermediary
stage
> > where there is still exchange, i.e. everyone gets rewarded according to
> > effort.
> >    <http://www.facebook.com/dezuanni>
> >  *Daniel Araya* <http://www.facebook.com/dezuanni>* *April 29 at 10:07am
> >  Michel, you are humorless on this subject. The point is not "my
> > interpretation" but the common understanding of a term loaded with
> > generations of assumptions. It is not merely an empty signifier but
comes
> > with over a century of political contestation. Tere clearly uses the
term
> > communism to highlight Marxism not despite it. So its not some 'new
road'
> > he's pointing to but a mere restating of a well-worn gospel. Build a
working
> > an example of this utopia and I'm sure people will begin to take it
> > seriously again. Until then...
> >    <http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=528245547>
> >  *Michel Bauwens*
<http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=528245547>* *April
> > 29 at 10:32am
> >  that is why I personally not use this terminology, because indeed it is
> > so loaded, and certainly in the U.S., can only lead to misinterpretation
> >
> >
> > --
> > Work: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhurakij_Pundit_University - Think
> > thank: http://www.asianforesightinstitute.org/index.php/eng/The-AFI
> >
> > P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  -
http://blog.p2pfoundation.net
> >
> > Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss:
> > http://listcultures.org/mailman/listinfo/p2presearch_listcultures.org
> >
> > Updates: http://del.icio.us/mbauwens; http://friendfeed.com/mbauwens;
> > http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens
> >
> >