[p2p-research] Building Alliances (basic income and entrepreneurship)

[Michel Bauwens]

what anonymous source, why is Setzer anonymous??

On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 3:41 AM, Stan Rhodes <stanleyrhodes at gmail.com> wrote:

> Michel,
>
> This needs to stop.  Period.
>
> I am offended you would quote some anonymous source as some sort of
> authority, weaving it into a quick hit-piece.
>
> You do not understand what Andrew is saying in nearly every email, and he
> attempts to tell you that, but you will not listen.    Although I have a few
> very minor quibbles with what he said, all he said is not controversial to
> me, with my limited knowledge of cognitive science.
>
> If you know another cognitive scientist, let him or her join the discussion
> reasonably with full visibility.  So much for honest debate...
>
> -- Stan
>
>   On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 10:18 AM, Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com
> > wrote:
>
>>   Hi Andrew,
>>
>> I just forwarded the text of another scientist, which shows how vacuous
>> your claim for absolute truth is,
>>
>> I"m really sorry, but your methods are so much worse than even magical
>> thinking, and can only lead to grave disasters for mankind. Humans are
>> neither purely animals nor machines, but complex entities with emergent
>> behaviour. In fact, there is no more magical thinking that the double claim
>> that 1) science and math are the only ways of knowing; and 2) that your
>> individual interpretation of math and science is the only valid one. This
>> absolute certainty equates with absolute disaster. It's a good reminder of
>> why democracy is so necessary to keep totalitarian approaches in check. Your
>> claim that humans are just computers and therefore machines, are in fact
>> extremist interpretations, not generally shared by the scientific community.
>> I'm not surprised that it is associated with a call for more concentration
>> of wealth as a guarantee for more innovation, and that you ignore the
>> studies showing how more concentrated capital has actually hurt innovation
>> in Silicon Valley. But don't let trival things as facts stand in the way of
>> your certainties.
>>
>> I'm not surprised that you are unwilling to submit your claims to a body
>> of scientists,
>>
>> Michel
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 12:52 AM, J. Andrew Rogers <
>> reality.miner at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>  On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 9:38 AM, Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> > The statement that the brain is just a computer, is highly
>>> controversial,
>>> > even in science, but I'm not going to claim your ignorant of that, but
>>> you
>>> > probably choose to simply ignore it.
>>>
>>>
>>> Sorry, but it is only controversial to you, you just choose to ignore
>>> the mountains of evidence.
>>>
>>> There is no measure by which a brain does not have the precise
>>> properties you would predict for a fairly conventional finite
>>> computer.  If you have evidence to the contrary, please publish it.
>>> You would be famous.
>>>
>>> Why would we believe in something that is contrary to all evidence?
>>> Even if it *was* incorrect, it would be a safe scientific claim
>>> because there is no contrary evidence to date.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > Humans and groups are indeed predictable to a certain degree, more than
>>> > people realize, but not absolutely and without limit.
>>>
>>>
>>> Sure, and the mathematical properties of this fact are well understood.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > I would like to make a bet.
>>> >
>>> > You state on the Edge, that the brain is just a computer, and if you're
>>> > right about the state of science, there should be absolutely no
>>> reaction on
>>> > discussion on it, since it is an obvious truth.
>>>
>>>
>>> Seriously, this isn't even an interesting topic.  It is settled
>>> science except for people unfamiliar with or unwilling to give up
>>> their magical thinking.  It is the same reason I don't engage in
>>> arguments about creationism versus evolution, there is no margin in it
>>> even among educated folk.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>  J. Andrew Rogers
>>> realityminer.blogspot.com
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Work: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhurakij_Pundit_University - Research:
>> http://www.dpu.ac.th/dpuic/info/Research.html - Think thank:
>> http://www.asianforesightinstitute.org/index.php/eng/The-AFI
>>
>> P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net
>>
>> Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss:
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>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>


-- 
Work: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhurakij_Pundit_University - Research:
http://www.dpu.ac.th/dpuic/info/Research.html - Think thank:
http://www.asianforesightinstitute.org/index.php/eng/The-AFI

P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net

Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss:
http://listcultures.org/mailman/listinfo/p2presearch_listcultures.org

Updates: http://del.icio.us/mbauwens; http://friendfeed.com/mbauwens;
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