[p2p-research] Life after capitalism (was: Re: labour, capital and p2p)

Thu May 28 10:28:34 CEST 2009

Hi Alex,

I like your approach, this is exactly the kind of thing we would need ...

The main thing is this: we need an organization that is not devoted to
profit-maximisation of selling bicyles at any price and without caring for
externalities, but one that cares for the use value of bicycles and uses the
market and any other mechanism to make this sustainable. Each loop we can
realize for each such project, creates a new 'post-capitalist' economic
logic ...

Michel

On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 9:15 PM, Alex Rollin <alex.rollin at gmail.com> wrote:

> I am still at a loss as to how to communicate my insight about the
> transcendence of capitalism and the new stage of production and community
> that follows and I keep making an effort.
>
> One thing that occurs to me to mention now is the value of 'services' in
> the new context of a world in which all people are 'doubly-free'.
>
> In capitalist industrialization we have products that become the property
> of the purchaser, in most cases, and it is at this point that the ...
> commons, or the aggregate of all resources available for production, is
> somewhat diminished, in a sense, by the transition of the goods/products and
> resources into private ownership.
>
> On a meta-theoretical level, the goods are still part of the flow of
> materials in society, unless shot into space, but, for argument's sake,
> these materials are removed.
>
> In reading through your PDF about the commons of the future I was inspired
> to mention what is becoming more and more common in the SOA (service
> oriented architecture) models of the software world, and to mention that
> this is being obviously extended into the realm of hard/durable goods
> manufacturing.
>
> Specifically, service oriented architecture allows for the extension of the
> 'commons' to include goods that are 'atomized' for personal use by
> maintaining a link, through services and maintenance, back to the larger
> common resource pool.
>
> Lifetime maintenance, leasing, and a whole host of industry terms are being
> used to categorize this evolving area.
>
> I realize some may argue with the mechanics of these innovations (I pause
> at using the word innovation) but I merely mention it to draw attention to a
> new-ish view of the commons as a flow of resources in the form of durable
> goods that pass through the hands of 'consumer-owner-producers' and back
> into the production shops that maintain and innovate on these goods.  These
> shops are also maintaining the 'new re-enclosure of the open commons" (just
> trying to show the connection, here) as goods and raw materials that are
> wrought, re-wrought, and cared for to meet the needs of society (messy).
>
> To me, this is an important little view of the 'new' because it sheds some
> light on the simplicity of targeted revolt (as opposed to the sought after
> ubiquitous revolt) of the doing from the deed, as I understand it from the
> Commoner site.
>
> As an example, I just came up with a little business plan.
>
>
>    - We start a little coop to make bicycles.
>    - We narrow the market to goods that have a naturally regular ownership
>    transition cycle, where the goods would normally be trashed.
>    - Specifically, we sell the use of childrens bicycles as a service.
>    - The shop and the bikes are owned by the consumers and producers
>    together.
>    - We 'lease-rent' the bikes for as long as needed, and then reclaim and
>    remanufacture them.
>    - Over time, the coop's larger mission of stewarding the raw materials
>    for bike manufacture are integrated.  We buy land for making rubber,
>    remanufacture tires, steel, whatever.
>    - We also teach people to be a part of this themselves.
>
>
> This is a pretty simple idea to increase the value of the 'bike mobility'
> commons, a new 're-enclosed' and relatively open commons (especially if
> redistributive economics enable those without to be those with).
>
> Anyways, we don't talk about this much, but it seemed like a nice time to
> mention it.  The SOA of the cmmn 'icon' car project out of the Netherlands
> follows this logic, generally.   People don't buy the cars...they become
> long term partner/owners in the enterprise.
>
> Alex Rollin
> http://alexrollin.com
> http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=501246535
>
>
>
> On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 3:26 PM, Christian Siefkes <christian at siefkes.net>wrote:
>
>> Ryan,
>>
>> Ryan Lanham wrote:
>> > Tell me what you think some of Marx's great and relevant insights on the
>> > present are?  Why don't we discuss his ideas rather than his iconic
>> > status.
>> >
>> > Your ideas on defining capital and labor are a bit broad.  I would
>>
>> They seem broad only for current society, since nowadays almost all labor
>> is
>> capitalistic. But historically they are quite specific: capitalism
>> requires
>> what Marx called the "doppelt freie Lohnarbeiter" ("doubly free worker" --
>> not sure what is the correct English translation), i.e. people who are
>> "free" in a double sense: "free" human beings who are allowed to sell
>> their
>> labor power (not slaves or serfs), but also "free" of the means of
>> production, i.e. without access to tools and resources what would allow
>> them
>> to produce for themselves, without having to sell their labor power.
>>
>> Today, almost everybody is a "doubly free worker", but that was not always
>> the case. Creating the doubly free worker was a historical process that
>> comprised, on the one hand, the liberation of slaves/serfs and, on the
>> other
>> hand, the "enclosure of the commons"
>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enclosure>, the privatization of land and
>> other resources which had formerly belonged to all. That historical
>> process
>> is described by Marx in his chapter(s) on the "so-called primitive
>> accumulation" in Capital I, starting here:
>> http://marxists.catbull.com/archive/marx/works/1867-c1/ch26.htm .
>>
>> While capitalism became possible only through the "enclosure of the
>> commons"
>> that separated people from direct access to the means of production, the
>> transition to a post-capitalist will require a "reopening of the commons,"
>> which reverses that historical process. And indeed we see such a reopening
>> already taking place, as new commons are created (free software, Wikipedia
>> etc.) and struggles for old, or former commons (land, water etc.) are
>> increasing.
>>
>> > encourage you to point me and others to a portrait of what such a system
>> > would look like...say on an island...or a sea stead.  How would it
>> > work?  Would interest and investment be forbidden?  What if most people
>> > didn't like those rules?
>>
>> Marx has only left sparse notes about how a post-capitalist society might
>> look like, as I mentioned--that was not his topic, and he considered any
>> detailed descriptions of such a society as premature and utopian. I guess
>> he
>> considered it impossible to really imagine such a society in his times,
>> and
>> he was probably right, but I also think that has changed since we're now
>> seeing the beginnings of a possible post-capitalist way of production
>> emerging around us: commons-based peer production.
>>
>> Of course, we're still far away from a fully fledged commons-based peer
>> economy, but I think we can get there. As Stan already mentioned, I've
>> written about how such a society might look like. For a short overview,
>> you
>> might want to check my recent article, "The Commons of the Future"
>> <http://www.commoner.org.uk/?p=78>.
>>
>> A more detailed explanation is available in a 5-part blog series, starting
>> here:
>>
>> http://www.keimform.de/2008/01/21/material-peer-production-part-0-traits-of-peer-production/
>> . And, of course, there is my book, "From Exchange to Contributions:
>> Generalizing Peer Production into the Physical World"
>> <http://peerconomy.org/wiki/Main_Page#The_Book>
>> (available for downloading and as a printed book).
>>
>> Best regards
>>        Christian
>>
>> --
>> |-------- Dr. Christian Siefkes --------- christian at siefkes.net ---------
>> |   Homepage: http://www.siefkes.net/   |   Blog: http://www.keimform.de/
>> |   Better Bayesian Analysis:           |   Peer Production Everywhere:
>> |   http://bart-project.com/            |   http://peerconomy.org/wiki/
>> |------------------------------------------ OpenPGP Key ID: 0x346452D8 --
>> Copyright, having turned from a regulation into a subsidy of publishing
>> industries, is the 21st century equivalent of drug legislation. Everyone
>> knows that it is obsolete, dysfunctional, and depriving people of
>> their rights; absurd wars are fought in its name. The simple fix is to
>> abolish it.
>>        -- Florian Cramer
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>
>
> --
> Alex
> I cannot teach anybody anything, I can only make them think.- Socrates
>
>
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