[p2p-research] Fwd: [ox-en] Project / Book

[Michel Bauwens]

Hi Mathieu,

I'm responding to some of your key issues,

see inline,

Michel

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Mathieu O'Neil <mathieu.oneil at anu.edu.au>
Date: Thu, May 28, 2009 at 6:50 AM
Subject: Fwd: [ox-en] Project / Book
To: Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com>



> Hi all
>
> The recent posts about the "social economy" have led me to
> consider some issues that I have not seen discussed on [ox] or
> P2PF for that matter. For example, where does the [ox] community
> stand on the issue of growth?

There is no life without growth, but infinite growth is a cancer. So I
personally think it is wrong to stress no-growth of de-growth, also because
it is politically suicidal. Refocusing growth on the immaterial aspects of
life which produce most happiness; conditioning material growth on
sustainability of the process; replacing gross and wasteful use of energy
with smart micro-applications, are to me principles that go in the right
direction. Without having read him in detail, I feel close to the general
approach by Herman Daly in those matters.




There is a recent push to rebrand
> capitalism as "green" (see Obama in the US, Sarkozy and Cohn-
> Bendit in Europe). But this green capitalism - from the Left or
> Right - is still based on the unlimited accumulation of stuff.

It is ultimately a contradiction, but it is also inevitable in the short
term that humanity chooses hybrid solutions. We also have to conceptually
separate market mechanisms from capitalism. Therefore, the shift to
sustainable market processes, the shift to wards modes of 'inclusional'
forms of the market, such as fair trade, social enterpreneurship, are still
very positive developments, and they operate according to non-capitalist
principles (no accumulation). We should be friends of all of those, like
Peter Barnes, David Korten, Paul Hawken, Hazel Henderson, which call for
'natural capitalism', 'capitalism 3.0', 'ethical markets', etc.. because
they lead to more sustainable market forms, even if they initially exist
within a overall framework of accumulation in the general system.


> An alternative to growth is what is known in French as "la
> decroissance" - a-growth, like you could talk about atheism as
> the opposite of religion. So ecological issues have to be
> thought about. The alienation of nature, not just the alienation
> of people. This would help to connect peer production to a very
> dynamic sector of radical thought.

I caution against a too close identification with that particular brand,
though we should dialogue and work together. Degrowth is essentially a
negative approach, I much prefer the transition town movement approaches,
which is geared to positive change.


>
> Then there's the question of elitism. Something I mention from
> time to time in relation to expertise. How to reconcile the fact
> of being a "big man" in a community because of technical
> competency with a democratic structure? There is no equality
> when some people have access to tools and controls which others
> don't understand. The bigger the technical system, the more
> technocratic power grows. This is the critique of technology
> made by Jacques Ellul and others. Something else that needs to
> be though about. Plus, how do complex technical systems such as
> hospitals, airports,

We need value-sensitive design that specifically balances out different
processes that you have so well identified in your book, that I recommend to
anybody for reading: meritocratic power of expertise, the charismatic power
of visioning and engagement, and the sovereign formal-democratic power of
the collective, need to be balanced out, with specific attentiont to
exclusion within peer processes.



electricity grids operate in the type of
> "commonalist" (you know what I mean) society which I see
> described (for example) by Christian Siefkes? Do we go back to a
> village structure where specialised tasks are impossible? What
> happens to neurosurgeons? Do they disappear?

There are different answers:

- the immaterial aspects (grid design, renewable energy design, healthcare
knowledge) is best suited for a commons approach, and has the added
advantage of radically bringing down the need for capital

- many of these structures can operate on less centralized principles

Peer production can only succeed if it keeps all the complexity of the
previous system, and further builds on it. So of course, not only do
neurosurgeons not disappear, but there will be more of them <g>


Michel
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