[p2p-research] the abundance of art

Sun May 3 23:48:04 CEST 2009

replace "science is always disrupting itself" with "contradicting or
reversing or undermining itself"

On Sun, May 3, 2009 at 2:47 PM, marc fawzi <marc.fawzi at gmail.com> wrote:

> The only thing, Paola, is that works of art last forever (if not for
> physical decay) while science is always disrupting itself...
>
> I would say art is far more resilient than science and thus more real.
>
> On Sun, May 3, 2009 at 8:06 AM, <paola.dimaio at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>>
>>> Yet, Science is the pre-supposed knowledge, the constraint barriers, and
>>> environment out of which Artistic creation attempts to evolve. Art is how
>>> you first try to see beyond existing known science.
>>>
>>> So, there is a symbiotic relationship between Art and Science  that is
>>> often un-acknowledged in much of existing academic thinking.
>>>
>>
>>
>> I think both are distinct ways to know the world, possibly different parts
>> of it, and for different purposes, but I would definiltey agree that there
>> is some scope for complementarity
>>
>> ps.
>> I should have mentioned that the mother of the artist in question who
>> owned  the clock, which after the creative transformation had lost its
>> intended functionality, was not interested in uniqueness as such
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, May 3, 2009 at 5:38 AM, <paola.dimaio at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> and you see you what I mean?  The light reflecting from a [future]
>>>>> perfect replica will be exactly the same as the light reflecting from the
>>>>> original from all angles and degrees... so why would the original be more
>>>>> vauable. It's human nature
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I think I know what you mean, that due to our human nature we attach a
>>>> higher value to an original, than to its copies even when absolutely
>>>> perfectly the same.
>>>>
>>>> For me though, an original piece of art is not just the product, the
>>>> exterior visible shape that we can see, but an intention, a 'first' a
>>>> breakthrough of logical scheme perhaps, a step that has never been taken
>>>> before, a way that reality has never been conceived or seen as before, and
>>>> as such ti vibrates at a unique frequency. A real original piece of art, and
>>>> I have seen only a few, has an essence that is not reproducible, because it
>>>> was generated by unique circumstances, in a unique space/time conjunction,
>>>> which was expressed in a unique/unprecedented brilliant form, and captured
>>>> sculpted or painted and will stay there forever. So what I am trying to say
>>>> is that the original and the copy are definitely not the same for me, even
>>>> when the latter is perfect. I would be interested to  explore the
>>>> possibility that its all in the mind though.
>>>>
>>>> Abundance is perhaps donating it to a foundation, making it accessible
>>>> free of charge to everyone forever and having chairs next to it so that
>>>> people can actually sit nearby, and allowing copies to be made and
>>>> circulated.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, May 3, 2009 at 2:03 AM, <paola.dimaio at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It seems that, despite art itself being intrinsically abundant, the
>>>>>> physical products of 'high art' (not the digital product), e.g. a Picasso
>>>>>> painting, are given some kind of scarce quality by people (a spiritual,
>>>>>> emotional or superstitious value) that makes them rare (or special) even if
>>>>>> they can be replicated ad infinitum and in an exact manner .
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> actually, I am not sure about replicability
>>>>> Having seen a few original masterpieces, and their copies, a very
>>>>> special energy and strenght emanates from the former
>>>>> My definition of a work of art is that it is a unique, and communicates
>>>>> some unique in a unique way
>>>>>
>>>>> this is why, I think, they are placed in public galleries where
>>>>> everyone can enjoy them,  I will be interested in contrasting abundance vs
>>>>> uniqueness in art, and maybe we could organise an exhibition one day about
>>>>> it
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Definitely related to p2p. The issue of why we create artificial
>>>>>> scarcity or why we seek it is core to the p2p economy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, May 2, 2009 at 5:54 PM, <paola.dimaio at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> oh yes, found it
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> (sorry if not directly relevant to p2p, but definitely
>>>>>>> a collective, and part of the commons imho)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> just for completeness
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the one i saw in Germany years ago was the Prinzhorn collection
>>>>>>> http://www.prinzhorn.uni-hd.de/beispiele/himmel_eng.shtml
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> discussed here  in a broader context
>>>>>>> http://www.gseart.com/exhibitions.asp?ExhID=455
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sun, May 3, 2009 at 1:35 AM, <paola.dimaio at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I saw an exhibition about ten year or so ago, not sure where
>>>>>>>> but I seem to remember Germany, there is also an exhibition book
>>>>>>>> going around,
>>>>>>>> it was the most beautiful art work made by psychiatric patients
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I am not sure its the same or just similar
>>>>>>>> but its on in London, lots of interesting links also to be found on
>>>>>>>> the web
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.wellcomecollection.org/press/2009/WTX053734.htm
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Even if your,re clinically insane you can make great art
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Paola Di Maio,
>>>>>>> ****************************************
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Marc Fawzi
>>>>>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/people/Marc-Fawzi/605919256
>>>>>> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/marcfawzi
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Paola Di Maio,
>>>>> ****************************************
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Marc Fawzi
>>>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/people/Marc-Fawzi/605919256
>>>> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/marcfawzi
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Paola Di Maio,
>>>> ****************************************
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>> Social Synergy
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>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Paola Di Maio,
>> ****************************************
>>
>>
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>>
>
>
> --
>
> Marc Fawzi
> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/people/Marc-Fawzi/605919256
> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/marcfawzi
>

-- 

Marc Fawzi
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/people/Marc-Fawzi/605919256
LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/marcfawzi
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