[p2p-research] debate on open agriculture

Sun Jul 26 20:15:59 CEST 2009

Practicing theorist sounds like a promising development.  I'd still prefer
theorizing practitioner as the overwhelmingly most important species in the
ecosystem of the commons, but one takes what one can get.

Ryan

On Sun, Jul 26, 2009 at 12:42 PM, Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com>wrote:

> thanks for the update!
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 12:37 AM, Samuel Rose <samuel.rose at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Paul Hartzog, Richard Adler and myself are writing an open book about it
>> here:
>>
>> http://flowsbook.panarchy.com/
>>
>> On the most general level we are stating:
>>
>>
>>    - Energy Commons <http://flowsbook.panarchy.com/Energy%20Commons>
>>    - Food Commons <http://flowsbook.panarchy.com/Food%20Commons>
>>    - Thing Commons <http://flowsbook.panarchy.com/Thing%20Commons>
>>    - Cultural Commons <http://flowsbook.panarchy.com/Cultural%20Commons>
>>    - Access Commons <http://flowsbook.panarchy.com/Access%20Commons>
>>
>>
>> One of the things that we are doing as a book project is also working on
>> ongoing creation of all of these types of commons. We are building open
>> source fabrication technology, using it to create energy producing tech,
>> working on open knowledge based food production, creating software that
>> creates an "access commons" via http://flows.panarchy.com/ open
>> specification, working with projects that are creating p2p cultural creation
>> (existing examples include the oort-cloud.org project, authorless project
>> and filmforward) So, we are practicing theorists. In the emerging system,
>> we'll all be theorists and practicioners. Doesn't mean that you have to know
>> and do everything, but it must be much more possible than it ever was
>> before.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jul 26, 2009 at 12:28 PM, Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Sam,
>>>
>>> do you have a clear idea of how the configuration of the new relocalized
>>> but globally interconnected, food system will look like ... i.e. what are
>>> the main constituent elements?
>>>
>>> glad to see you are making such practical progress!
>>>
>>> Michel
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Jul 26, 2009 at 9:23 PM, Samuel Rose <samuel.rose at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 11:09 PM, Michel Bauwens <
>>>> michelsub2004 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> As a matter of fact, Havana and Shanghai produce a majority of their
>>>>> vegetables, and China's urban population meets around 85% of its
>>>>> vegetable needs through rooftop and vacant lot gardening.
>>>>>
>>>>> Kevin,
>>>>>
>>>>> do you have any sources on this?
>>>>>
>>>>> I heard 60%, but I cannot believe that contempary shangai would still
>>>>> allow this, there are hardly any rooftop gardens left ...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On sam's excellent food site, only available after registration, I saw
>>>>> estimates that local food production could move from 5 to 25% of the food
>>>>> supply but not more,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I don't know too much about China, so I cannot comment there but a few
>>>> thoughts here:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The 5-25% talked about on http://localfoodsystems.org that Michel
>>>> refers to is the projected economic opportunity under *current* condtions.
>>>> This is for the midwest great lakes region. Different locales could see
>>>> different results under current conditions. Plus, there is a huge but
>>>> overlooked long tail market of niche needs, which could easily boost that
>>>> number even under current conditions, as people like
>>>> http://www.localharvest.org/farms/M16461 Blue Pike Farm concentrate on
>>>> meeting niche needs in urban areas. If CSA's are not in competition with
>>>> each other and with industrial food importers, and instead work together to
>>>> meet plural niche local needs, they can outcompete and self-sustain
>>>> practically indefinitely. We also see that Open Source technology will play
>>>> a huge role, especially in areas where specialty crops, aquaculture, etc are
>>>> not available year round, or at all.
>>>>
>>>> So, there is potential beyond 5-25% under current conditions. But, this
>>>> takes collaboration and cooperation among the praticipants and throughout
>>>> the food chain.
>>>>
>>>> There are many in the agricultural industry who are convinced that
>>>> current conditions will change, however. A year ago this started becoming
>>>> apparent to traditional economists (
>>>> http://www.econbrowser.com/archives/2008/06/more_on_degloba.html )
>>>>
>>>> The reality is that a globalized, subsidized food system is
>>>> unsustainable. There are multiple ways in which we all subsidize global food
>>>> systems. Many contries tax payers pay for deals cut between countries that
>>>> allow low cost food to be imported. People in locations like China, South
>>>> and Central America, Asia, and Rural North America subsidize by sacrificing
>>>> their health and the health of their local environment, and the destruction
>>>> of their local economies, culture, and general freedom.  The cost of fuel to
>>>> ship food around, the cost in taxes to subsidize shipping lane protection
>>>> and the illusion of low price, and the human social cost are enough evidence
>>>> for me to be convinced that current global food systems conditions are
>>>> headed towards collapse in several ways.
>>>>
>>>> What this means is that worldwide, local food production will *increase*
>>>> substantially beyond the projections that are based on current conditions of
>>>> 5-25%. Especially when people start to realize the benefits inherent in
>>>> reconfiguring food production locally, and bolstering local economies.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Michel
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Sam Rose
>>>> Social Synergy
>>>> Tel:+1(517) 639-1552
>>>> Cel: +1-(517)-974-6451
>>>> skype: samuelrose
>>>> email: samuel.rose at gmail.com
>>>> http://socialsynergyweb.com
>>>> http://socialsynergyweb.org/culturing
>>>> http://flowsbook.panarchy.com/
>>>> http://socialmediaclassroom.com
>>>> http://localfoodsystems.org
>>>> http://openfarmtech.org
>>>> http://notanemployee.net
>>>> http://communitywiki.org
>>>>
>>>> "Long ago, we brought you all this fire.
>>>> Do not imagine we are still chained to that rock...."
>>>>
>>>> http://notanemployee.net/
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Working at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhurakij_Pundit_University -
>>> http://www.dpu.ac.th/dpuic/info/Research.html -
>>> http://www.asianforesightinstitute.org/index.php/eng/The-AFI
>>>
>>> Volunteering at the P2P Foundation:
>>> http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net -
>>> http://p2pfoundation.ning.com
>>>
>>> Monitor updates at http://del.icio.us/mbauwens
>>>
>>> The work of the P2P Foundation is supported by SHIFTN,
>>> http://www.shiftn.com/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> --
>> Sam Rose
>> Social Synergy
>> Tel:+1(517) 639-1552
>> Cel: +1-(517)-974-6451
>> skype: samuelrose
>> email: samuel.rose at gmail.com
>> http://socialsynergyweb.com
>> http://socialsynergyweb.org/culturing
>> http://flowsbook.panarchy.com/
>> http://socialmediaclassroom.com
>> http://localfoodsystems.org
>> http://openfarmtech.org
>> http://notanemployee.net
>> http://communitywiki.org
>>
>> "Long ago, we brought you all this fire.
>> Do not imagine we are still chained to that rock...."
>>
>> http://notanemployee.net/
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Working at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhurakij_Pundit_University -
> http://www.dpu.ac.th/dpuic/info/Research.html -
> http://www.asianforesightinstitute.org/index.php/eng/The-AFI
>
> Volunteering at the P2P Foundation:
> http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net -
> http://p2pfoundation.ning.com
>
> Monitor updates at http://del.icio.us/mbauwens
>
> The work of the P2P Foundation is supported by SHIFTN,
> http://www.shiftn.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
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