[p2p-research] Workshop on Media Ecologies: Q&A: Sam Rose

Thu Aug 27 04:02:01 CEST 2009

Superb Sam, I've added this typology to our Commons and Manufacturing
sections, along with an entry,
http://p2pfoundation.net/Infrastructure_Commons

If you work these different things out, thanks for sharing them with me,

Michel

On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 10:44 PM, Samuel Rose <samuel.rose at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 8:40 PM, Michel Bauwens<michelsub2004 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Sam,
> >
> > where can I find a nice overview summary of the basic needs that need to
> be
> > covered by a p2p infrastructure,
>
>
>
>
> Well this is the topic of the book that Paul, Rick Adler and myself
> are writing at http://flowsbook.panarchy.com/  of course it is only
> about 1/4 of the way there so the concise view you need isn't there
> quite yet :-)
>
> Actually, the chapter outline we currently have gives the FLOWS model
> that we are saying is the basic model people require for all forms of
> basic survival.
>
> # Energy Commons
> # Food Commons
> # Thing Commons
> # Cultural Commons
> # Access Commons
>
>
> Creating an infrastructure commons around the above needs will create
> what we are calling a "wealth generating ecology".
>
> "Wealth generating ecology" is what I offer to people when they ask me
> to create an open source business model for them. I tell them that
> they don't need a "business model" they need a "wealth generating
> ecology" that generates multiple types of wealth, defined by what the
> people and systems in the ecology decide is 'wealth'. (For instance,
> in Adam Arvidsson's "Ethical Economy", sound ethics and actual trust
> are one of the highest forms of "wealth" in the system. )
>
> Energy and Food commons are self explanatory (in fact if you really
> think about it, food is actually part of the energy commons, as food
> is transformed and stored energy for human physical systems) "Thing
> Commons" above is what some people call "means of production". Open
> license machines, designs, materials, etc. This is probably going to
> be Paul's offering to the group. But, we'd work on it with you ahead
> of time either way.
>
> "Access Commons" is our current place holder for access to data flows,
> designs, networks, resources, anything that is a building block
> towards basic survival. Plus, it addresses the encirclement of
> concepts and resources which were never meant to have access blocked
> off from (like atomics particles and compounds, genes, etc that
> otherwise naturally flow and evolve freely within systems).
>
> The FLOWS model as a model for the creation of a "wealth generating
> ecology" (not FLOWS internet specification, which is meant to be a
> real world example of the model) suggests that human activity should
> emulate the energy flow of natural systems. By blocking and damming
> the flow of energies, and access to deposits of built up resources, we
> are trying to defy the 2nd law of thermodynamics. Our systems ultimate
> collapse because the defiance of the law is a charade, and is used to
> help keep a small amount of people safe from the effects of this 2nd
> law of entropic dissipation.
>
> We are saying that anyone can apply our model right now, to human
> systems, and see results right away.
>
> To apply, you need to align your inputs and consumptions with the
> outputs of others, and make your outputs available as inputs for
> others.
>
> Designs need to apply a principle of plurality, many ways to employ
> and reuse the same resource. Plurality is not enough, the principle of
> diversity is also needed, many different ways to use many different
> resources.
>
> Paul just stated to me that Complex Adaptive systems optimize the flow
> of energy in emergent ways, they usually do not block, or hoard energy
> flows in systems when left to evolve and emerge on their own.
>
> So, if we take energy that is in the form of matter, shape it into a
> fast food container, use it once, and then throw it into a hole in the
> ground, we are blocking the potential for optimized dissipation of
> that energy. Complex systems theory contains many of the simple
> rules-based models that we need to start optimizing our energy flows
> in useful ways.
>
>
> >
> > I'd love to have this, and work on some illustrations to show what kind
> of
> > community-enterpreneurial-funding coalitions would be necessary to carry
> it
> > out. I feel this mapping and call for enterpreneurial coalitions may well
> be
> > the next focus of the p2p foundation,
> >
> > Michel
> >
> > On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 9:29 PM, Samuel Rose <samuel.rose at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> > Right, we might say that the paper folding is stored so other folk or
> >> > bots
> >> > might fold the paper in that same configuration later on.
> >> > You may not have paper and want to make it yourself? Okay, there's
> your
> >> > representation, here's where the materials are located. No bots in the
> >> > area?
> >> > No problem, all of this is in walking distance, and other folk may be
> >> > interested in your project to help place those needed items closer to
> >> > your
> >> > location.
> >> >>
> >>
> >> Nathan, I am sorry to tell you that I personally have little interest
> >> in investing the amount of time that I know it will take to create and
> >> execute the paper folding bot in 3D room demonstration that you are
> >> suggesting here.
> >>
> >>
> >> I am personally much more interested in putting time like that into
> >> practical applications that can help people, like developing
> >> automation systems for aquaponics and hydropnics, creating protocols
> >> for open source software systems that people are currently using to
> >> talk to each other, creating mobile food processing units for use in
> >> local food systems, things like that.
> >>
> >> The idea is cool, but not something that I am interested in investing
> >> time into. In the end, we'd have a robot that can fold paper :-)
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> > How 'bout EMC? Fenn forwarded this info to the OM list.
> >> > http://wiki.openkollab.com/wagn/Enhanced_Machine_Controller_EMC
> >> >
> >>
> >> I use EMC2 http://www.linuxcnc.org/content/view/2/4/lang,en/ I agree
> >> it is great!
> >>
> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Although, it seems like it would be easier to just use telesurgery
> >> >> robots and cameras if you want to do remote folding! I guess it
> >> >> depends on what the real goal is here.
> >> >
> >> > The goal is to do anything remotely!
> >> >
> >>
> >> Our goal here is to first help people address the basic needs for
> >> energy, food, shelter, and general physiological and psychological
> >> survival using open source software and technology. Retorifitting
> >> existing urban infrastructure, putting vacant land and buildings to
> >> use, localizing food production, that sort of thing. I frankly way too
> >> busy with that work to rise the challenge of the remote paper folding
> >> robot.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> A more practically immediately implementable example, IMO,  of what
> >> >> FLOWS and open standards can do with regard to flexible fabrication
> >> >> would be to allow people to store and serve multiple parts of a
> >> >> "package" of CAD files, bill of materials, parametrics data, and any
> >> >> other relative data about a technology, or the technologies needed to
> >> >> make that technology, in a distrbuted way (like on multiple servers).
> >> >
> >> > I hope Zach (cc'd) you might have something to say on this with his
> work
> >> > in
> >> > CAD repositories (Thingiverse) and distributed manufacturing. You're
> >> > coming
> >> > to the workshop, right? ;)
> >>
> >> Yes, coming to the workshop for sure.
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> These packages could still be maintained by a specific project or
> >> >> person. That project or person would really do the job of "vetting"
> >> >> the contents of that package so that other people reasonably know
> they
> >> >> can trust it.
> >> >
> >> > It would be best if this aspect were automated, via rates of
> selection,
> >> > 'do
> >> > you like?' input requests, or some other automated selection
> criteriori.
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Well, think of it this way, you could make a standard way to represent
> >> a package, and then you could make unlimited applications that add in
> >> functionality like question asking (just as there are multiple
> >> applications that work with debian package management system). I would
> >> not put this extra functionality into a package management system
> >> itself, though.
> >>
> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> But, the same files could live in many, many packages,
> >> >> each maintained by a specific maintainer. FLOWS gives a standard way
> >> >> of letting a system know that your files or data are part of a
> package
> >> >> (or to submit for inclusion in a package). Now, you can park your
> >> >> design files *anywhere*, yet they can still be part of a package.
> >> >
> >> > Yes. Redudancy where it counts, just in case a server or two
> >> > crashes--the
> >> > mesh gots you covered.
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> Another practical immediate example is that you could export certain
> >> >> contents of those files to be repackaged as a PDF, and even create a
> >> >> print on demand book from that collection of files. You could
> actually
> >> >> export a collection of files in any way that is possible through
> >> >> existing open source libraries. A FLOWS based component could also
> >> >> send out all kinds of meta data about the packages. Who is accessing
> >> >> them, multiple materials sources for what the package is made of, etc
> >> >
> >> > Sounds as if that would be a practical implement you can charge these
> >> > proprietarians for royally so as to put the reserve notes to better
> use:
> >> > meaning: less. ;)
> >> >
> >> > Nathan
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> --
> >> Sam Rose
> >> Social Synergy
> >> Tel:+1(517) 639-1552
> >> Cel: +1-(517)-974-6451
> >> skype: samuelrose
> >> email: samuel.rose at gmail.com
> >> http://socialsynergyweb.com
> >> http://socialsynergyweb.org/culturing
> >> http://flowsbook.panarchy.com/
> >> http://socialmediaclassroom.com
> >> http://localfoodsystems.org
> >> http://notanemployee.net
> >> http://communitywiki.org
> >>
> >> "The universe is not required to be in perfect harmony with human
> >> ambition." - Carl Sagan
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> p2presearch mailing list
> >> p2presearch at listcultures.org
> >> http://listcultures.org/mailman/listinfo/p2presearch_listcultures.org
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Work: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhurakij_Pundit_University -
> Research:
> > http://www.dpu.ac.th/dpuic/info/Research.html - Think thank:
> > http://www.asianforesightinstitute.org/index.php/eng/The-AFI
> >
> > P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  -
> http://blog.p2pfoundation.net
> >
> > Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss:
> > http://listcultures.org/mailman/listinfo/p2presearch_listcultures.org
> >
> > Updates: http://del.icio.us/mbauwens; http://friendfeed.com/mbauwens;
> > http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> --
>  Sam Rose
> Social Synergy
> Tel:+1(517) 639-1552
> Cel: +1-(517)-974-6451
> skype: samuelrose
> email: samuel.rose at gmail.com
> http://socialsynergyweb.com
> http://socialsynergyweb.org/culturing
> http://flowsbook.panarchy.com/
> http://socialmediaclassroom.com
> http://localfoodsystems.org
> http://notanemployee.net
> http://communitywiki.org
>
> "The universe is not required to be in perfect harmony with human
> ambition." - Carl Sagan
>

-- 
Work: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhurakij_Pundit_University - Research:
http://www.dpu.ac.th/dpuic/info/Research.html - Think thank:
http://www.asianforesightinstitute.org/index.php/eng/The-AFI

P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net

Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss:
http://listcultures.org/mailman/listinfo/p2presearch_listcultures.org

Updates: http://del.icio.us/mbauwens; http://friendfeed.com/mbauwens;
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