[p2p-research] The failure of micro-credit?

[Michel Bauwens]

Hi Ryan,

you have to be careful with research that filters out subjective
testimonies, they may be missing something,

but it is entirely possible for a social system to be helping individuals,
while structurally failing,

my opinion is that microfinance is 'good', but not 'sufficient', and
'dangerous', when it filters out all the other things that still need to be
done, but that shouldn't stop us to use microfinance as part of a
transformative agenda,

Michel

On Mon, Aug 24, 2009 at 8:41 PM, Ryan Lanham <rlanham1963 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Michel,
>
> I concur with all you say...could have written it.  I too am puzzled by
> Sam's response but it is consistent with the Yale research.  I am currently
> scratching my head hoping Grameen and the now thousands of other
> microfinance organizations step up to respond.  It is a profound challenge.
> I spend a portion of almost every day making microfinance loans.  It would
> hurt deeply to find such work is not only not helpful, but is indeed
> hurtful.  I find it hard to believe...along lines you suggest, but that is
> the current and loudest research finding on the topic from a top scholar and
> a respected institution.
>
> I literally don't know how to respond.  I have traded messages with
> Africans who have found their loans to be transformative...the possibility
> to thrive and get out of poverty.  How can this be?
>
> Ryan
>
> On Sun, Aug 23, 2009 at 9:28 PM, Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> hi Sam,
>>
>> I'm puzzled by your 'total' opposition to credit. Even most monetary
>> reformers/transformers recognize the difference between turnover credit, and
>> investment credit. They usually say the problem is that contemporary money
>> conflates them, and that a proper separation is better. In fact, people like
>> Thomas Greco advocate, convincingly that a mutual credit clearing system
>> would be much superior to the current money system.
>>
>> I don't think the bangladeshi women would have access to any pools in the
>> first place ... However, they could issue their own currency/credit clearing
>> system for their own exchanges, bypassing the need for 'bank's and
>> debt-based money.
>>
>> I've never seen microfinance as a panacea, but from the documentaries I
>> have seen, there is a huge boost in the dignity and collective identity of
>> those particpating, at least in the good schemes. Isn't the problem that
>> microfinance has become commercial, with outfits such as in mexico now
>> asking interest that is even higher than normal banks?
>>
>> Michel
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Aug 23, 2009 at 11:32 PM, Samuel Rose <samuel.rose at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Ryan wrote:
>>>
>>> >Date: Sun, 23 Aug 2009 11:11:47 -0500
>>> >From: Ryan Lanham <rlanham1963 at gmail.com>
>>> >Subject: [p2p-research] The failure of micro-credit?
>>> >To: Peer-To-Peer Research List <p2presearch at listcultures.org>
>>> >Message-ID:
>>>        <9134ad230908230911l2d535155n36ee5bef301a8934 at mail.gmail.com
>>> >>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>>
>>> >Editorial note:  I am big advocate for micro-credit.  I am saddened by
>>> this
>>> >study, but cannot disprove its findings. One big P2P ideas seems
>>> inherently
>>> >flawed.
>>>
>>> >
>>> http://www.3quarksdaily.com/3quarksdaily/2009/08/does-microlending-really-help-the-poor.html
>>>
>>> >Ryan
>>>
>>> I have to agree with this. All the way back in 2005-2006 when
>>> BarCampBank http://www.barcampbank.org project first really took off,
>>> I was one of the only people advocating against debt-creating
>>> mechanisms (like micro lending).
>>>
>>> Resource pooling, coupled with targeted investment are the way to go,
>>> if money is to be involved. A pool of money could be created, which
>>> could then pay out when projects meet and sustain a criteria that is
>>> defined by the investing group. This is similar to C.A. Fitts "solari"
>>> model. The investing group could work this similar to "bounties". Or,
>>> could take a different approach with impoverished people and lower the
>>> barrier to encourage community cooperation towards co-creation of
>>> local basic needs infrastructure.
>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Work: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhurakij_Pundit_University - Research:
>> http://www.dpu.ac.th/dpuic/info/Research.html - Think thank:
>> http://www.asianforesightinstitute.org/index.php/eng/The-AFI
>>
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>


-- 
Work: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhurakij_Pundit_University - Research:
http://www.dpu.ac.th/dpuic/info/Research.html - Think thank:
http://www.asianforesightinstitute.org/index.php/eng/The-AFI

P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net

Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss:
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