[p2p-research] disagreement by deletion/addition

Thu Dec 6 19:46:06 CET 2007

What about when the nature of the way we publish on the internet changes?
Michel has already talked about this in his response, which I received while
typing up this one.

Basically, DbD tends to become more desirable for wiki communities that are
gaining larger "audiences", larger collections of inbound and outbound
links, and more usage/activity. When one (openly editable) wiki begins to
build up lots of links and usage, some of the people invested in the wiki,
and even new comers might decide they want to control the message through
deletion, often giving the reason that they don't want to encourage certain
patterns of usage by making it seem as if their existence is tolerated.

One of the paradigms we created with the WikiHive model
(WikiHive<http://www.communitywiki.org/en/WikiHive>
http://www.communitywiki.org/en/WikiHive – multiple installs of one wiki,
working together)  is the ability for people to instantly add a new wiki,
that is then connected automatically by links and recent changes to the
"main" wiki. This is a decentralizing tool that is an attempt to make a more
even playing field, and to make exploration of topics more faceted, and to
take into account that there are many view points. Now, it is possible to
create a whole new wiki, to explore from your viewpoint, yet still keep it
networked and linked to the wikis that grew out of. This is less of a
"forking", and more of a "faceting".

I host examples of this approach here:

http://socialsynergyweb.net/cgi-bin/wiki/HiveChanges
http://socialsynergyweb.com/cgi-bin/wiki2/HiveChanges
http://eartwiki.org/cgi-bin/hive/HiveChanges

and the first version of this http://www.communitywiki.org/odd/RecentChanges

This set up allows a person to simply tye the name of their wiki into a
form, like this:

http://socialsynergyweb.com/cgi-bin/wiki2/Startup

This is based on http://oddmuse.org wiki engine (it is also currently
possible to do the same thing with MoinMoin wiki engine, and some similar
features http://prowiki.org). Some really interesting and useful features
include:

   - "sister site" links at the bottom of pages that are "NearLinked"
   - Combined recent changes among all wikis in wiki hive
   - ability to combine recent changes with other wiki hives
   - ability to near link to wikis that are based on other wiki engines
   (like moinmoin)
   - ability to create streams of output, and simple input forms
   - ability to transclude pages into other pages
   - ability to turn "anchors" into "objects" that can be linked to
   (making comments into useful content that is reference able)
   - ability to create custom content style sheets, some of which can be
   configures to create, for instance, paper authoring, that prints referenced
   papers
   http://socialsynergyweb.net/cgi-bin/wiki/PaperWriting/RecentChanges
   - Support for multiple languages and switching languages on the same
   page

beyond all of that, this design pattern for wiki community encourages DbA
over DbD

it is a new, decentralized way to scale-up wiki, that puts more control into
the user's hands and encourages link and promoted "addition", over burying
deletion. I call it "burying" because the wiki still holds a record int he
case of most wiki engines if you delete content. But this still makes it
more difficult to find, and is obscured from search engines, which
understandably do not follow all of the available revisions).

We would love feedback on this additive, proliferation-based, and
diversity-encouraging approach to wiki community building. Even if it is
harsh criticism. We feel we have the basic structure in a very solid state,
and we understand that the "user interface" and information architecture
could be improved (both are openly editable by users).

On Dec 6, 2007 12:31 PM, Paul B. Hartzog <paulbhartzog at gmail.com> wrote:

> conversation starter:
>
> Deletionism, or Disagreement by Deletion
>
> long time ago in my naive days
> Sunir Shah and I got talking about what was good about wikis.
>
> one of the key things was:
> 1) disagreement by deletion
> vs.
> 2) disagreement by addition
>
> DbD was the old-school political philosophy of exclusive practice,
> i.e. deciding who is "in" and who is "out"
>
> DbA was the new-school of pluralization, pluralism, and conversation,
> i.e. including perspectival acknowledgement as part of the process
>
> I actually used to lecture that this was a KEY reason why wikis are
> politically revolutionary, which is that by using DbA they
> 1) mesh with a multivocal world
> 2) function on inclusion instead of fragmentation (echo chamber)
>
> Now we see the "new" spaces, turning into "old" spaces
> by adopting the same rules as the old.
>
> Question:
> Is this a historical inevitability.  Will new open spaces that emerge,
> ALWAYS become co-opted by the old rules systems?  Will they
> ALWAYS be forced (as they scale?) to adopt the old rules?
>
> thoughts?
>
> -p
>
> --------------------------------------------------------
> http://www.PaulBHartzog.org
> http://www.panarchy.com
> PaulBHartzog at PaulBHartzog.org
> PaulBHartzog at panarchy.com
> PHartzog at umich.edu
> --------------------------------------------------------
> The Universe is made up of stories, not atoms.
>                 --Muriel Rukeyser
>
> See differently, then you will act differently.
>                 --Paul B. Hartzog
> --------------------------------------------------------
>
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>

-- 
Sam Rose
Social Synergy
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Related Sites/Blogs/Projects:
OpenBusinessModels: http://socialsynergyweb.net/cgi-bin/wiki/FrontPage
http://p2pfoundation.net
http://blog.p2pfoundation.net
http://www.cooperationcommons.com
http://barcampbank.org
http://bfwatch.barcampbank.org
http://communitywiki.org
http://extinctionlevelevent.com

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