Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2022 04:18:04 +0000
To: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
From: alicexbt <alicexbt@protonmail.com>
Reply-To: alicexbt <alicexbt@protonmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Bitcoin covenants are inevitable
Precedence: list

Hi Jorge,


Misinformation is false or inaccurate information, especially that which is=
 deliberately intended to deceive. A combination of 'misleading' and 'infor=
mation'. Here are a few examples and I am sure I missed a lot of others but=
 its difficult for me to keep a track of everything:


1) Sapio is open source and everything mentioned in tweet is false: https:/=
/web.archive.org/web/20220503050140/https://twitter.com/coinableS/status/15=
21354192434073602

2) Personal attacks on author of BIP 119 with false information: https://ni=
tter.net/s3cp256k1/status/1521238634111770624

3) Andreas Antonopoulos shared false things about CTV and explained by Ryan=
 in this email: https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/202=
2-May/020414.html

4) Misleading things shared in these emails by Michael Folkson:

    https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2022-January/01=
9728.html

    https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2022-April/0202=
35.html

    https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2022-April/0202=
86.html

    https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2022-April/0203=
43.html

    https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2022-April/0203=
86.html

5) Peter Todd and Zac shared misleading things about BIP 119, bitcoin and L=
2. I replied in this email: https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bit=
coin-dev/2022-April/020322.html

6) Social media influencers like Peter McCormack tweeted they don't underst=
and BIP 119 but its an attack (this was even retweeted by developers like P=
eter Todd): https://nitter.net/PeterMcCormack/status/1521253840963653632

7) Some misconceptions about BIP 119 cleared by Bitcoin Magazine: https://b=
itcoinmagazine.com/technical/what-is-bip-119-bitcoin-controversy-explained

8) There were lies and misinformation about BIP 119 on social media accordi=
ng to this Bitcoin Magazine article: https://bitcoinmagazine.com/technical/=
analyzing-bip119-and-the-controversy-surrounding-it

9) John Carvalho tweeting false things:

    https://nitter.net/BitcoinErrorLog/status/1468599535538745359

    https://nitter.net/BitcoinErrorLog/status/1522652884218822658

    https://nitter.net/BitcoinErrorLog/status/1442554615967354880

    https://nitter.net/search?q=3DMIT%20(from%3ABitcoinErrorLog)

10) Greg Maxwell responding to misinformation related to BIP 119 but adding=
 false things in the comments: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/ui=
m560/bip_119/i7dhfpb/


I am not surprised by your email but it would be better if the people who a=
re interested in reviewing BIP 119 could raise the bar and not share mislea=
ding information.


/dev/fd0


Sent with Proton Mail secure email.
------- Original Message -------
On Sunday, June 5th, 2022 at 12:12 AM, Jorge Tim=C3=B3n <jtimon@jtimon.cc> =
wrote:


> "Some people say CTV is contentious, but they're spreading misinformation=
"? Really? Seriously?Come on, guys, we can do better than nina jankovich an=
d the "fact checkers".
> Please, rise the bar.
> On Fri, Jun 3, 2022, 19:44 alicexbt via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.li=
nuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>
> > Note: This email is an opinion and not an attack on bitcoin
> >
> > Covenants on bitcoin will eventually be implemented with a soft fork. C=
TV is the easiest and best possible way OP_TX looks good as well. Apart fro=
m the technical merits, covenants will improve a few other things:
> >
> > - Developers can build interesting projects with real demand in market.
> > - Students learn Sapio and not just solidity.
> > - Better tooling could be available for application developers.
> > - Maybe we see bitcoin developer hackathons in different countries.
> > - Demand for block space might increase, it wont be just exchanges and =
coinjoin.
> > - Funding of bitcoin developers and projects might improve. Wont need t=
o convince a few people for grants.
> >
> > **Why covenants are not contentious?**
> >
> > Some people may write paragraphs about CTV being contentious, spread mi=
sinformation and do all types of drama, politics etc. on social media but t=
here are zero technical NACKs for CTV. We have discussed other covenant pro=
posals in detail on mailing list and IRC meetings with an open minded appro=
ach.
> >
> > All the developers that participated in the discussion are either okay =
with CTV or OP_TX or covenants in general.
> >
> > **How and when should covenants be implemented in Bitcoin?**
> >
> > I don't think we should wait for years anticipating a proposal that eve=
ryone will agree on or argue for years to pretend changes are hard in Bitco=
in. We should improve the review process for soft fork BIPs and share hones=
t opinions with agreement, disagreement on technical merits.
> >
> > I prefer BIP 8 or improved BIP 8 for soft fork but I won't mind anythin=
g else being used if that improves Bitcoin. Covenants implemented in Bitcoi=
n before the next cycle would provide opportunity for developers to build i=
nteresting things during the bear market. Ossification supporters also beli=
eve there is some window that will close soon, maybe doing changes consider=
ing each case individually will be a better approach. CTV is not a rushed s=
oft fork, less people followed the research and it was not mentioned on soc=
ial media repeatedly by the respected developers like other soft forks.
> >
> > /dev/fd0
> >
> >
> > Sent with Proton Mail secure email.
> > _______________________________________________
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> > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev