Received: from sog-mx-4.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.194] helo=mx.sourceforge.net) by sfs-ml-4.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1WXDmJ-0002nY-4w for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Mon, 07 Apr 2014 17:56:15 +0000 Received-SPF: pass (sog-mx-4.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com: domain of gmail.com designates 209.85.219.51 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.219.51; envelope-from=brent.shambaugh@gmail.com; helo=mail-oa0-f51.google.com; Received: from mail-oa0-f51.google.com ([209.85.219.51]) by sog-mx-4.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) id 1WXDmH-0004x5-5G for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Mon, 07 Apr 2014 17:56:15 +0000 Received: by mail-oa0-f51.google.com with SMTP id i4so7133643oah.10 for ; Mon, 07 Apr 2014 10:56:07 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.182.165.3 with SMTP id yu3mr18305057obb.14.1396893367676; Mon, 07 Apr 2014 10:56:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.76.12.105 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Apr 2014 10:56:07 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <5342C833.5030906@gmail.com> <5342D1DB.8060203@monetize.io> <5342D9FA.8080102@monetize.io> Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2014 12:56:07 -0500 Message-ID: From: Brent Shambaugh To: Mike Hearn Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c2fcbaf893bb04f6779430 X-Spam-Score: -0.6 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam Filtering performed by mx.sourceforge.net. See http://spamassassin.org/tag/ for more details. -1.5 SPF_CHECK_PASS SPF reports sender host as permitted sender for sender-domain 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (brent.shambaugh[at]gmail.com) -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 1.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message -0.1 DKIM_VALID_AU Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain 0.1 DKIM_SIGNED Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid -0.1 DKIM_VALID Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature X-Headers-End: 1WXDmH-0004x5-5G Cc: Bitcoin Development Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Why are we bleeding nodes? X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 07 Apr 2014 17:56:15 -0000 --001a11c2fcbaf893bb04f6779430 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Okay awesome. It seems like I set up a Litecoin node without knowing it (because it was like this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=128122.0) I was able to bootstrap it (https://litecoin.info/). On Mon, Apr 7, 2014 at 12:40 PM, Mike Hearn wrote: > It uses ~no electricity, it's not like mining. > > The primary resources it needs are disk space and bandwidth, after an > intensive initial day or two of building the database. > > Actually, I wonder if we should start shipping (auditable) pre-baked > databases calculated up to the last checkpoint so people can download them > and boot up their node right away. Recalculating the entire thing from > scratch every time isn't sustainable in the long run anyway. > > > On Mon, Apr 7, 2014 at 7:35 PM, Brent Shambaugh > wrote: > >> How difficult would it be to set up a node? Using lots of electricity at >> home (if required) could be an issue, but I do have a Webfaction account. >> >> >> On Mon, Apr 7, 2014 at 12:16 PM, Gregory Maxwell wrote: >> >>> On Mon, Apr 7, 2014 at 10:01 AM, Mark Friedenbach >>> wrote: >>> > On 04/07/2014 09:57 AM, Gregory Maxwell wrote: >>> >> That is an implementation issue-- mostly one that arises as an indirect >>> >> consequence of not having headers first and the parallel fetch, not a >>> >> requirements issue. >>> > >>> > Oh, absolutely. But the question "why are people not running full >>> > nodes?" has to do with the current implementation, not abstract >>> > capabilities of a future version of the bitcoind code base. >>> >>> The distinction is very important because it's a matter of things we >>> can and should fix vs things that cannot be fixed except by changing >>> goals/incentives! Opposite approaches to handling them. >>> >>> When I read "resource requirements of a full node are moving beyond" I >>> didn't extract from that that "there are implementation issues that >>> need to be improved to make it work better for low resource users" due >>> to the word "requirements". >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Put Bad Developers to Shame >>> Dominate Development with Jenkins Continuous Integration >>> Continuously Automate Build, Test & Deployment >>> Start a new project now. Try Jenkins in the cloud. >>> http://p.sf.net/sfu/13600_Cloudbees >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Bitcoin-development mailing list >>> Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development >>> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Put Bad Developers to Shame >> Dominate Development with Jenkins Continuous Integration >> Continuously Automate Build, Test & Deployment >> Start a new project now. Try Jenkins in the cloud. >> http://p.sf.net/sfu/13600_Cloudbees >> _______________________________________________ >> Bitcoin-development mailing list >> Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development >> >> > --001a11c2fcbaf893bb04f6779430 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Okay awesome. It seems like I set up a Litecoin node witho= ut knowing it (because it was like this:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3D1= 28122.0) I was able to bootstrap it (https://litecoin.info/).


On Mon,= Apr 7, 2014 at 12:40 PM, Mike Hearn <mike@plan99.net> wrote:<= br>
It uses ~no electricity, it's not like mining.
The primary resources it needs are disk space and bandwidth, af= ter an intensive initial day or two of building the database.
Actually, I wonder if we should start shipping (auditable) pre-b= aked databases calculated up to the last checkpoint so people can download = them and boot up their node right away. Recalculating the entire thing from= scratch every time isn't sustainable in the long run anyway.

On Mon, Apr 7, 2014 at 7:35 PM, Brent Sham= baugh <brent.shambaugh@gmail.com> wrote:
How difficult would it be t= o set up a node? Using lots of electricity at home (if required) could be a= n issue, but I do have a Webfaction account.


On Mon, Apr 7, 2014 at 12:16 PM, Gregory Maxwell <gmaxwell@gmail.com&= gt; wrote:
On Mon, Apr 7, 2014 at 10:01 AM, Mark Friedenbach <mark@monetize.io> wrote:
> On 04/07/2014 09:57 AM, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
>> That is an implementation issue— mostly one that arises as a= n indirect
>> consequence of not having headers first and the parallel fetch, no= t a
>> requirements issue.
>
> Oh, absolutely. But the question "why are people not running full=
> nodes?" has to do with the current implementation, not abstract > capabilities of a future version of the bitcoind code base.

The distinction is very important because it's a matter of things= we
can and should fix vs things that cannot be fixed except by changing
goals/incentives!  Opposite approaches to handling them.

When I read "resource requirements of a full node are moving beyond&qu= ot; I
didn't extract from that that "there are implementation issues tha= t
need to be improved to make it work better for low resource users" due=
to the word "requirements".

---------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---
Put Bad Developers to Shame
Dominate Development with Jenkins Continuous Integration
Continuously Automate Build, Test & Deployment
Start a new project now. Try Jenkins in the cloud.
http://p.= sf.net/sfu/13600_Cloudbees
_______________________________________________
Bitcoin-development mailing list
Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-de= velopment


-----------------------------------------------------------= -------------------
Put Bad Developers to Shame
Dominate Development with Jenkins Continuous Integration
Continuously Automate Build, Test & Deployment
Start a new project now. Try Jenkins in the cloud.
http://p.= sf.net/sfu/13600_Cloudbees
_________________________________________= ______
Bitcoin-development mailing list
Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-de= velopment



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