Received: from sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.193] helo=mx.sourceforge.net) by sfs-ml-3.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1Wf8ul-00060q-Dn for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Tue, 29 Apr 2014 14:21:43 +0000 Received-SPF: pass (sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com: domain of gmail.com designates 209.85.217.174 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.217.174; envelope-from=gmaxwell@gmail.com; helo=mail-lb0-f174.google.com; Received: from mail-lb0-f174.google.com ([209.85.217.174]) by sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) id 1Wf8uj-0005g2-0G for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Tue, 29 Apr 2014 14:21:43 +0000 Received: by mail-lb0-f174.google.com with SMTP id c11so208267lbj.5 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2014 07:21:34 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.112.17.102 with SMTP id n6mr1943107lbd.39.1398781294353; Tue, 29 Apr 2014 07:21:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.112.89.68 with HTTP; Tue, 29 Apr 2014 07:21:34 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <5359E509.4080907@gmail.com> <535A60FE.10209@gmail.com> <535BA357.6050607@gmail.com> <535CFDB4.1000200@gmail.com> <20140428214102.GA8347@netbook.cypherspace.org> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2014 07:21:34 -0700 Message-ID: From: Gregory Maxwell To: Mike Hearn Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: -1.6 (-) X-Spam-Report: Spam Filtering performed by mx.sourceforge.net. See http://spamassassin.org/tag/ for more details. -1.5 SPF_CHECK_PASS SPF reports sender host as permitted sender for sender-domain 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (gmaxwell[at]gmail.com) -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record -0.1 DKIM_VALID_AU Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain 0.1 DKIM_SIGNED Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid -0.1 DKIM_VALID Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature X-Headers-End: 1Wf8uj-0005g2-0G Cc: Bitcoin Dev Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Coinbase reallocation to discourage Finney attacks X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2014 14:21:43 -0000 On Tue, Apr 29, 2014 at 7:13 AM, Mike Hearn wrote: > It only works if the majority of hashpower is controlled by attackers, in > which case Bitcoin is already doomed. So it doesn't matter at that point. These parties wouldn't generally consider themselves attackers=E2=80=94 nor would many users (presumably everyone who mines on ghash.io, for example)=E2=80=94 rather they'd they may consider someone using hashpower voting to reassign coins to be an attacker, and reassigning their coins instead to be a morally justified and pragmatic response. I think we're capable here of discussing the specifics without needing to use generalizations which invite definitional arguments... I don't think that bombastic language like doomed helps the dialog.