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Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2014 14:15:13 +0200
Message-ID: <CANEZrP0fjzuUKh0Jmk9c99ne81hdxZdTnhw6sq47Na7AC4n04A@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mike Hearn <mike@plan99.net>
To: Chris Pacia <ctpacia@gmail.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11362fb01c159504f7c8cd81
Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] 0 confirmation txs using replace-by-fee
 and game theory
Precedence: list

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>
> This scheme would discourage people from attempting a Finney attack
> because they would end up worse off if they did.
>
Phrased another way, it simply makes every block a Finney attack that
charges the maximum double spending fee possible. This doesn't solve the
problem.

Beyond needing to double balances, what if the shop is selling me a phone
on contract? So the actual cost of the phone is lower than the real price
on the assumption of future revenue. Alice double spends (aka steals) the
phone, paying double the artifically lower cost but still making a good
saving. Bob does not end up with "nothing", he ends up in the red.

But there's a much simpler way to dispose with this idea. Jorge, go down to
your local bars and cafes, and ask them if they'd be willing to accept a
form of payment that allows anyone to steal from them by simply paying
double the purchase price to some other random guy. They *will* look at you
as if you're crazy. Why would they ever do that?

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blo=
ckquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #c=
cc solid;padding-left:1ex"><p dir=3D"ltr">This scheme would discourage peop=
le from attempting a Finney attack because they would end up worse off if t=
hey did.</p>
</blockquote><div>Phrased another way, it simply makes every block a Finney=
 attack that charges the maximum double spending fee possible. This doesn&#=
39;t solve the problem.</div><div><br></div><div>Beyond needing to double b=
alances, what if the shop is selling me a phone on contract? So the actual =
cost of the phone is lower than the real price on the assumption of future =
revenue. Alice double spends (aka steals) the phone, paying double the arti=
fically lower cost but still making a good saving. Bob does not end up with=
 &quot;nothing&quot;, he ends up in the red.</div>
<div><br></div><div>But there&#39;s a much simpler way to dispose with this=
 idea. Jorge, go down to your local bars and cafes, and ask them if they=
9;d be willing to accept a form of payment that allows anyone to steal from=
 them by simply paying double the purchase price to some other random guy. =
They <u>will</u>=C2=A0look at you as if you&#39;re crazy. Why would they ev=
er do that?</div>
</div></div></div>

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