From extropians-request@extropy.org Thu Oct 7 14:41:47 1993 Return-Path: Received: from usc.edu by chaph.usc.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1+ucs-3.0) id AA20663; Thu, 7 Oct 93 14:41:44 PDT Errors-To: Extropians-Request@gnu.ai.mit.edu Received: from ude.tim.ia.ung.gnu.ai.mit.ed (ude.tim.ia.ung.gnu.ai.mit.edu) by usc.edu (4.1/SMI-3.0DEV3-USC+3.1) id AA25562; Thu, 7 Oct 93 14:41:33 PDT Errors-To: Extropians-Request@gnu.ai.mit.edu Received: by ude.tim.ia.ung.gnu.ai.mit.edu id AA05648; Thu, 7 Oct 93 17:31:35 EDT Received: from news.panix.com by ude.tim.ia.ung.gnu.ai.mit.edu via TCP with SMTP id AA05643; Thu, 7 Oct 93 17:31:19 EDT Received: by news.panix.com id AA20388 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for exi-maillist@ung.gnu.ai.mit.edu); Thu, 7 Oct 1993 17:31:10 -0400 Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1993 17:31:10 -0400 Message-Id: <199310072131.AA20388@news.panix.com> To: Extropians@extropy.org From: Extropians@extropy.org Subject: Extropians Digest X-Extropian-Date: October 7, 373 P.N.O. [21:30:43 UTC] Reply-To: extropians@extropy.org Errors-To: Extropians-Request@gnu.ai.mit.edu Status: RO Extropians Digest Thu, 7 Oct 93 Volume 93 : Issue 279 Today's Topics: [1 msgs] CRYPTO: Brand name on criminal markets [3 msgs] GUNS, SOC: Burglary and countermeasures [2 msgs] GUNS,SOC: burglary survival [1 msgs] LEGAL: Judgement Proof [1 msgs] SATIRE: I'm baaaaack! [1 msgs] books online [2 msgs] burglary survival [7 msgs] burglary survival (was: Extortion Counterm [1 msgs] Administrivia: No admin msg. Approximate Size: 51632 bytes. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1993 12:10:49 -0400 From: tburns@gmuvax.gmu.edu (T. David Burns) Subject: books online At 11:46 AM 10/6/93 +0100, Charlie Stross wrote: > >* Specialist books. No more big print runs; they'll be > produced on demand. See it in a catalogue, order it -- > ten minutes later, it's yours. Or, as you're paying for it, another copy is being printed to go on the shelf? Or better yet, bookstores can frustrate shoplifters the way video rantal stores do - the shelf copy will be an incomplete copy (table of contents, chapter one, highlights) good for browsing, not worth stealing. This in itself could bring down the cost of books - shoplifting is a significant cost to some bookstores. Dave tburns@gmuvax.gmu.edu (T. David Burns) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1993 09:24:41 -0700 From: Brian D Williams Subject: burglary survival I would like to make a suggestion as far as home security is concerned, it is particularly usefull if you have a significant other and/or latchkey kids. Provide them with a safe place to retreat to, you already have such a room in your house/apartment, its called a bathroom. With a few simple modifications it is extremely secure. 1) Replace the door with a heavy outside equivilent type door equipped with a deadbolt. 2) glass blocks instead of an openable window are preferrable. 3) install a telephone so help can be summoned, even better keep a cell phone in there in case phone lines are cut. 4) a maglight or a cyalume lightstick in the medicine cabinet to provide light in case of loss of power. 5) second floor bathrooms are even better. 6) a concealed bracket/shelf/holster under the watertank is a good place to keep an extra handgun. In the event of an emergency you or your loved ones will have a safe retreat, and the ability to summon help. they will obviously not be troubled by needing a bathroom or water. Brian Williams Extropian Cypherpatriot ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 10:07:15 PDT From: tcmay@netcom.com (Timothy C. May) Subject: CRYPTO: Brand name on criminal markets Perry Metzger writes: > > Indeed, use of untraceable escrow services will make the market for > > killings-for-hire much more liquid, so to speak. > > Wouldn't it be easy to catch such services with sting operations? > > I still fail to see what the problem is. Much harder. Current stings focus on catching those making the deals, that is, the seller or the buyer of the contract killing, With this system, the parties are unknown to each other, so stings fail at this level. The sting has to focus on nabbing the actual killer, a much more difficult task, as the killer may take his own time (weeks or months), may use very subtle methods (poisons, snipings) or even not-so-subtle methods (explosives). And who would agree to be the "pigeon" in such a sting? Not me! --Tim -- .......................................................................... Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay@netcom.com | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero 408-688-5409 | knowledge, reputations, information markets, W.A.S.T.E.: Aptos, CA | black markets, collapse of governments. Higher Power: 2^756839 | Public Key: PGP and MailSafe available. Note: I put time and money into writing this posting. I hope you enjoy it. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1993 13:14:53 -0400 From: Duncan Frissell Subject: LEGAL: Judgement Proof W.>Duncan, what is "judgment proof"? I'm most curious, as I'm sure W.>are many others here. Sorry I've been off for a week w/o a laptop... To be judgment proof (proof against a legal judgment) means that even if you are fined or subject to a civil judgment, nothing can be collected from you. Aside from the normal privacy protection strategies (you all receive all your mail at mail receiving services, don't you ;) ) there are a number of steps you should take to reduce your vulnerability to judgments. 1) Live in rented accommodations. Home ownership in the jurisdiction where you are violating the law is a bad idea. It can be accomplished if you are very careful to construct a firewall between you and the nominal owner (see clean team-dirty team considerations below) but it is usually much safer to not own anything major or to own it in another jurisdiction. This doesn't mean that you can never own a house. Just own one later in your life in a safer jurisdiction after the statutes of limitations have run. Real estate isn't such a hot investment these days in any case. 2) Drive an old car. 3) Keep financial accounts in other countries. Use small domestic accounts for day-to-day activities. Have your important accounts elsewhere. 4) Convert your job to contingent- or self- employment. Most people are controlled by their reluctance to leave their job. Even though garnishment is rare these days because it is expensive, you are still vulnerable to losing your job if you encounter legal difficulties. If you are self-employed you are unlikely to fire yourself and if you are a contingent worker it is easier for you to change jobs/states/countries when things become hot. Contingent workers can also recover from legal difficulties more easily since they can disguise prison terms "I took two years sailing in the Pacific. Something I've always wanted to do." and employers check up on them less since they can be fired at will. >From an unpublished article of mine called How to Break the Law: "Studies of the effect of criminal conviction on income have shown that the average blue-collar worker regains the same wage earned before imprisonment within one year after release. On the other hand, imprisonment dramatically reduces the wages of white-collar workers, whose jobs are more likely to involve reputation and "credentials". If you are self-employed, you will be in better shape, because you are unlikely to fire yourself for "criminal" activity. The change in employment towards contingent workers should reduce the effects of legal problems on white collar workers as well. Since employers can fire contingent workers at will, these workers undergo less vetting than "permanent" employees." 5) Use the clean team-dirty team approach. Within a family or affinity group, you can divide the responsibilities. Some group members remain scrupulously legal and are vested with all the group assets. This is the clean team. The law violators in the group constitute the dirty team and have no assets. If this is done carefully it can work. The clean team members have to show sufficient income and clean resources to account for their assets. Obviously, you want to avoid fraudulent transfer problems. If any transfers occur before the dirty team begins its illegal activity, there should be no problem. Dirty team income can be accumulated offshore while clean team members hold all the onshore assets. It helps if it is difficult to prove the existance of a relationship between the clean and dirty teams. If different countries and names are involved, it can be very difficult for investigators to uncover the links. Translation of "judgment proof" for you crypto types out there -- make the keyspace occupied by your assets so large that an exhaustive search is beyond the resources of the investigators. W.>When an indictment seems imminent, change legal regimes. You can W.>move they can't (without declaring war). International relocation. W.>What did Marc Rich do? Mark Rich was a commodities speculator in New York. He was indicted by the Feds and fled to Switzerland. He has taken Spanish citizenship. He is still listed on the Forbes (?) list of the 400 richest Americans. He is worth about $400 million. One of his companies continued to sell nickel to the US Mint (to debase the coinage) long after he had fled from prosecution. Duncan Frissell Who will be discussing such matters in another jurisdiction on November 20th at ECFP '93: The First European Conference on Computers, Freedom and Privacy. DUNCAN FRISSELL is an attorney and consultant on matters of personal and financial privacy. Duncan will discuss what the practitioners of the new digital privacy can learn from traditional privacy techniques: "Traditional Privacy Joins the Digital Revolution" --- WinQwk 2.0b#1165 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1993 13:20:10 -0400 From: habs@panix.com (Harry S. Hawk) Subject: books online >At 11:46 AM 10/6/93 +0100, Charlie Stross wrote: >> >>* Specialist books. No more big print runs; they'll be >> produced on demand. See it in a catalogue, order it -- >> ten minutes later, it's yours. Dave wrote: >rantal stores do - the shelf copy will be an incomplete copy (table of >contents, chapter one, highlights) good for browsing, not worth stealing. OR, in the same vein, make the highlight's, etc. available via a public domain WWW or WAIS (etc.) cite, with easy methods for purchasing the entire "book." /hawk -- Harry S. Hawk ON Vacation ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 18:31:36 BST From: jrk@sys.uea.ac.uk (Richard Kennaway) Subject: burglary survival Heath G. Goebel writes: >Do most gun-owners on this list leave their gun at home, >persumably for at home protection? Or do you keep your gun >on your person? > >I expect that most would keep it on their person, >except where prohibited by law, in order to afford >both protection at home and on the streets. As a UK citizen, I have little choice but to leave my guns (four pistols of various types) in a locked safe at home, except when I go shooting. However, if it were legal to carry them for self-protection, I would not bother to do so, nor even keep a loaded gun by the bed at night. I live in a peaceful area of a peaceful town, and my home has only been burgled once (I was out of the country at the time). In fact, I have never been anywhere (including, for example, London, Amsterdam, New York, San Francisco, and Las Vegas) where I have felt in need of a handy weapon. On the other hand, if I were in a place where concealed-carry permits were routinely available, I would get one, and at least part of the reason I took up shooting in the first place was the possibility that it might one day be a useful skill to have. -- ____ Richard Kennaway __\_ / School of Information Systems Internet: jrk@sys.uea.ac.uk \ X/ University of East Anglia uucp: ...mcsun!ukc!uea-sys!jrk \/ Norwich NR4 7TJ, U.K. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1993 12:40:10 -0500 From: cpresson@jido.b30.ingr.com (Craig Presson) Subject: burglary survival In <93Oct7.092446pdt.14166-3@well.sf.ca.us>, Brian D Williams writes: [...] |> Provide them with a safe place to retreat to, you already have such |> a room in your house/apartment, its called a bathroom. With a few |> simple modifications it is extremely secure. |> |> 1) Replace the door with a heavy outside equivilent type door |> equipped with a deadbolt. And a peephole, helps with claustrophobia and gives warning of approaching intruders (keeps rescuers from being shot through the door, too!). |> 3) install a telephone so help can be summoned, even better keep |> a cell phone in there in case phone lines are cut. |> |> 4) a maglight or a cyalume lightstick in the medicine cabinet to |> provide light in case of loss of power. Cyalume is pretty weak. Maglight and extra batteries (rotated rechargeables or whatnot). |> 5) second floor bathrooms are even better. Top floor. Preferably with a narrow approach, like if the door faces the stairwell directly. |> 6) a concealed bracket/shelf/holster under the watertank is a good |> place to keep an extra handgun. Watched the _Godfather_, did you? Actually that should probably still be a lockbox, esp. if some of your family members are hoplophobic or not trained; only the ones who know how to use the pesky thing (and will if needed) know the combination. Also frustrates the burglar who was smart enough to break in while no one is home. |> In the event of an emergency you or your loved ones will have a |> safe retreat, and the ability to summon help. they will obviously |> not be troubled by needing a bathroom or water. I like this plan, except that if someone actually has to fire that damned handgun it's going to ruin everyone's ears. ^ / ------/---- cpresson@ingr.com (Freeman Craig Presson) /AS 5/20/373 PNO; ISGS 9/373; ExI 4/373, NRA 5/373, etc. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1993 13:50:28 -0400 From: habs@panix.com (Harry S. Hawk) Subject: burglary survival >From recent descriptions of house burglary in the UK from Extropians who live there, it seems like there might be a larger about of such burglary there, per captia, than in the US. Are their any studies to back up my viewpoint? FYI, I am 31 years old and have been "robbed" twice, once in high school and once in college. In both cases, this was based on stupidity on my part, was not done by professionals, and was most likely preventable. -- Harry S. Hawk ON Vacation ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1993 10:54:22 -0700 From: dkrieger@Synopsys.COM (Dave Krieger) Subject: GUNS, SOC: Burglary and countermeasures >From: Charlie Stross >Subject: burglary survival (was: Extortion Counterm >X-Extropian-Date: Remailed on October 7, 373 P.N.O. [08:38:51 UTC] >X-Message-Number: #93-10-275 > >The house I grew up in (from age 2 to 21) was burgled 18 times. > >This somewhat shocking fact (the average burglary rate in the UK >is only once per 20-25 years) can be attributed partly to the >neighbourhood [...] I'm not the spawn >of some millionaire; but when my parents bought their house they >were looking for the biggest one they could find, not the most >defensible. They paid for their mistake over 20 years, but in >the process we learned a lot about home security -- the hard way. I don't mean to denigrate your parents' intelligence, but after the fifth or sixth burglary, why didn't they consider moving to a less ritzy (and risky) neighborhood)? >1. Burglar alarms. > [Excellent advice on how to design an alarm system elided... Home > Automation Laboratories should publish this section in their catalog.] > >6. Guns (NOT). > > Once, when I was 16, I was alone in the house on a hot > summer's day. [...We were] burgled > while I was in the house. The burglar had come in through > a shielded downstairs window [...] and had worked his way > upstairs. > > But consider this. Imagine if my father had owned a gun > for self-defense. In the US, handguns are commonly kept > loaded in the bedroom, in case of intrusion. Under such > circumstances, the intruder would have found the gun > _before_ discovering he was not entirely alone in the house. > Already wired on adrenaline from fear of discovery, the > newly armed burglar would have instantly become much more > dangerous -- and instead of fleeing, might have been > sufficiently emboldened to do something stupid. Ahem. Charlie, this is what trigger locks are for. You keep the trigger lock on unless you're in the room; this prevents criminals from getting to it first and using it against you. This is fairly basic gun lore (I don't even own a gun and I know this). >8. The present day. > [Discussion of the layout of Charlie's present living space.] While in general I despise the architecture of San Francisco -- the typical SF residence is a townhouse which touches its neighbors on both sides, with no gaps -- such homes are quite defensible from burglary. The front wall is visible to the street; the back wall is (mostly) inaccessible from the street. > Me, I've been burgled the best part > of twenty times, and this is my opinion on the basis of that > experience. Um, somehow the fact that you've been burgled twenty times doesn't make you an expert in my eyes, Charlie. Sort of like calling Ayn Rand an expert on lung cancer... > My real worry is violence. [...] Come to think of it, I think > even a burglar is probably worth more than #1000 (if you can > figure out a way to make use of them). [...] > I don't believe that shooting a > dumb kid who's only trying to steal my video recorder is a > fair exchange for the sleepless nights I'd have afterwards. Hmmm. Charlie says it himself: > Your mileage may vary. I think I would much rather have my stereo, computer, etc., rather than give them up, even at the cost of the burglar's life, and I think you should too (unless you're willing to argue that burglary is desirable), for these reasons: I've been considering for a while how one puts the Extropian principle of Spontaneous Order into practice. The application of the other four at a personal level seems fairly straightforward, but spontaneous orders are generally big societal processes -- how does Joe Extro implement his appreciation of them in a way that makes a difference? A remark by Eric Drexler made me realize that this is done by _incentivizing those around you to act in ways that result in the kind of society you want_. For example, suppose that guns were widely owned in the U.S., and that their owners are trained to use them properly. (Compared to the U.K., they are already widely owned, but I'm talking >50% of the population.) Furthermore, suppose _everyone knows_ that this is the gun ownership rate. A burglar who knows he has a 50% chance of surprising a homeowner who has a gun and knows how to use it (as opposed to the probability today, which is low everywhere and practically zero in some jurisdictions) will, if he is at all rational, take up some other hobby (I don't care what happens to irrational people). Now, if I own and maintain a gun, I am helping not only myself, I am helping my neighbors who don't have guns, because the burglar can't know in advance which apartments have guns and which ones don't -- gun ownership can be considered a public good in this sense. The notion that crimes against my property aren't "really" crimes, and that a burglar who only wants to quietly and non-violently take away the fruits of my labors deserves in some sense to get away with it for being a nice non-violent fellow, is, frankly, nonsense. My possessions represent hours of my labor -- I worked to earn the money I used to purchase them; days or years of my _life_ are crystallized in each object in my home. Burglars and murderers are more similar than you realize; they both steal time from your life -- the murderer steals future time; the burglar steals time that has already passed, by stealing the things for which you traded that time. Burglars deserve to be stopped with deadly force as much as murderers or armed robbers do. dV/dt DVDT on HEx who has very few sleepness nights except when thinking about the FDA ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 14:06:24 EST From: kwaldman Subject: CRYPTO: Brand name on criminal markets People have been discussing how contract killing would be made easier or not with Crypto. One could apply the same arguments to arson. Joe Arson can now contact Harry Building Owner to contract to burn his building anonymously. etc, etc. In today's Wall Street Journal there is an article on a string of arson here in the US over the past 10 years. The authorities have no idea 1. How the places are ignited 2. Who is doing it. and thus no connection to the building owners who have been payed off by the insurance companies.. They do suspect that 1. The person is extremely qualified technologically 2. And s/he is a professional. The fires are so hot they destroy large buildings within minutes leaving no trace of combustibles. Witnesses say they see a white hot column just before the building is engulfed. Some temp. measurements show greater than 815 C degrees (one was 2760 C [5000 F])!!!!! [red phosphorous perhaps ?] Very interesting article. All this without cryptography, maybe..... Karl (Of course most of the article is about the flames and pure conjecture about the person) Of course this could be a simple case of spontaneous combustion. fnord. -------- Karl M. Waldman kwaldman@bbn.com BBN Systems and Technologies ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 11:11:30 PDT From: tcmay@netcom.com (Timothy C. May) Subject: burglary survival > I am 31 years old and have been "robbed" twice, once in high school and > once in college. In both cases, this was based on stupidity on my > part, was not done by professionals, and was most likely preventable. > > > -- > Harry S. Hawk ON Vacation ^^^^^^^^^^^ <---note advertisement! Where'd you say you lived, Harry? How long will you be gone? On the subject of burglaries, I found Charlie's piece quite sobering. I have no iron bars on my windows, only cheap locks, and I often find some window I've left partly open or unlocked. And I also have a bunch of expensive lying out all over the house--I won't list items, as I may've already said too much for all of you burglars out there grepping for targets. In my 41 years, no burglaries, except once when my car was broken into and my stereo stolen, about 15 years ago. My sister and brother have never been burgled, to my knowledge, nor have my parents. All totaled, zero home burglaries in perhaps 80 household-years. Nor do I read about many home burglaries, certainly nothing approaching the incredible frequency Charlies Stross described. It makes me think that Britain treats casual burglaries as just supplemental income for those on the dole. Perhaps the fact that most households here in the U.S have guns has something to do with this apparent disparity in burglary rates? (I admit the data are anecdotal, based on what I just wrote. Anybody have actual data on burglary rates?) That many folks I know will "shoot first, ask questions later" is the kind of "I'm crazier than you are" strategy that works so well in "chicken" games. As they say, "Better to be judged by twelve than carried by six." As for the deaths of casual burlgars, as a sig I just saw says: "Hey, you! This is the gene police. Out of the pool!" --Tim -- .......................................................................... Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay@netcom.com | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero 408-688-5409 | knowledge, reputations, information markets, W.A.S.T.E.: Aptos, CA | black markets, collapse of governments. Higher Power: 2^756839 | Public Key: PGP and MailSafe available. Note: I put time and money into writing this posting. I hope you enjoy it. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 11:34:54 PDT From: Robert Brooks Subject: SATIRE: I'm baaaaack! In case anyone was wondering why I haven't been heard from in a couple days, it's because my posting privileges had been suspended. Fortunately, the new list software isn't very secure and I was able to launch a worm that re-enabled me. Witness the following exchange between Mr. Krieger and I, submitted for your entertainment (well, horror shows _are_ entertainment) (headers included to demonstrate authenticity): > From dkrieger@Synopsys.COM Tue Oct 5 15:06 PDT 1993 > Received: from hprdash.rose.hp.com by hprrb.rose.hp.com with SMTP > (16.6/15.5+IOS 3.21) id AA07687; Tue, 5 Oct 93 15:06:11 -0700 > Return-Path: > Received: from hp.com by hprdash.rose.hp.com with SMTP > (16.6/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA02323; Tue, 5 Oct 93 15:07:03 -0700 > Received: from chronos.synopsys.com by hp.com with SMTP > (16.8/15.5+IOS 3.13) id AA23996; Tue, 5 Oct 93 15:07:04 -0700 > Received: from gaea.synopsys.com by chronos.synopsys.com with SMTP id AA25216 > (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Tue, 5 Oct 1993 15:10:20 -0700 > Received: from lachesis.synopsys.com by gaea.synopsys.com with SMTP id AA06290 > (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Tue, 5 Oct 1993 15:05:46 -0700 > Received: from [146.225.30.20] (mac-30.20.synopsys.com) by lachesis.synopsys.com with SMTP id AA06056 > (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Tue, 5 Oct 1993 15:05:42 -0700 > Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1993 15:05:42 -0700 > Message-Id: <199310052205.AA06056@lachesis.synopsys.com> > To: rb@hprrb.rose.hp.com > From: dkrieger@Synopsys.COM (Dave Krieger) > X-Sender: dkrieger@corp > Subject: Re: DIET: Too little fat causes brain damage! > Status: RO > > Mr. Brooks -- > > Your most recent post to the Extropians list breaks a number of list rules. > It doesn't even appear to be a META:-style message regarding the conduct > of list discussion; it just appears to be you bitching about the people who > objected to your false post. Whether those of us who didn't see your > disclaimer are humor-impaired or not is immaterial; the message in which > you flame your critics is definitely unsuitable for the list and should > have been conducted via private e-mail (or preferably, not at all). I have > referred your message to the list administrator, requesting that he suspend > your ability to post to the list for thirty days. > > Dave Krieger > Director, Extropy Institute > > At 2:39 PM 10/5/93 -0700, Robert Brooks wrote: > >####################################################################### > ># # > ># WARNING: This post may contain dry humor, satire, presumption, # [ remainder of quote of my post elided ] > From To:dkrieger@Synopsys.COM Tue Oct 5 15:42:38 1993 > Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 15:42:38 PDT > To: dkrieger@Synopsys.COM > Subject: Re: DIET: Too little fat causes brain damage! > In-Reply-To: <199310052205.AA06056@lachesis.synopsys.com>; from "Dave Krieger" at Oct 5, 93 3:05 pm > > > > > Mr. Brooks -- > > > > Your most recent post to the Extropians list breaks a number of list rules. [ remainder of quote elided ] > > > You _are_ joking, right? > > Robert > Then, sweating, an hour later: > From To:dkrieger@Synopsys.COM Tue Oct 5 16:44:40 1993 > Date: Tue, 5 Oct 93 16:44:40 PDT > To: dkrieger@Synopsys.COM > Subject: Re: DIET: Too little fat causes brain damage! > > Dave, > > You haven't responded to my inquiry as to whether you are serious or not. > If you are, I'm quite ready to try to understand the nature of my > transgression and make amends. > > If not, then, well, you've clearly won the dryness contest by having me > worry so! > > Regards, > > Robert > Still no response. I was shocked, simply shocked, when I tried posting to the list and found that my privileges had indeed been suspended. Swift and sure cyber-justice in this brave new-list-software world, indeed! One wonders what may await us tomorrow. Is tar-and-feathering next? Mark my words, this comes with a price. How can we parry this injustice? After we do, we must still be eternally vigilant, and watch this situation like a hawk. There's more. I'm sure everyone has noticed the latency of postings after the list moved to panix. Ostensibly a cost-efficiency measure, I've discovered that this is not really the case. Rather, the list is now moderated. Or really, since no one was told it was moderated, it is _censored_. The List Censor, usually Dave Krieger, reviews all postings and removes, alters, or returns for Extropianly-Correct editing those he doesn't like. I'm not sure why he let my posting that he objected to through--I guess he thought it would make me look bad, and provide a better excuse for suspending me. So to get this post through, I had to program my worm so that it not only enabled my posting, but also delayed posts to Krieger so that he sees them no sooner than anyone else. Naturally, people whose posts are censored are warned not to say anything, and if they try, the warning is censored and retribution is exacted. They'll kick me off completely for this one. IF they can. But I thought the List should know... The Broox Perversion (I'm sorry--I just can't help it. I'll blame it on negative peer pressure and end-of-project giddiness. "The devil makes work for idle hands", etc.) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 11:21:22 PDT From: tcmay@netcom.com (Timothy C. May) Subject: CRYPTO: Brand name on criminal markets Karl Waldman writes: > People have been discussing how contract killing would be made > easier or not with Crypto. One could apply the same arguments to arson. > Joe Arson can now contact Harry Building Owner to contract to burn his > building anonymously. etc, etc. Indeed, many crimes are nearly impossible to stop. What crypto allows is a _market_ that is less susceptible to stings. > The fires are so hot they destroy large buildings within minutes > leaving no trace of combustibles. Witnesses say they see a white hot > column just before the building is engulfed. Some temp. measurements > show greater than 815 C degrees (one was 2760 C [5000 F])!!!!! > [red phosphorous perhaps ?] I'll look for this article. (I'm always interested in flames.) It sounds like the special binary incendiary packs the CIA developed at their Point Hardy, North Carolina facility. The Gander, Newfoundland crash in 1985, in which 250 soldiers died while returning from Lebanon, apparently was caused or exacerbated by such incendiaries being brought back on the flight (dangerous to mix armaments and incendiaries with troops, of course). I'd guess the Mob has liberated some of these special incendiary packs. -Tim -- .......................................................................... Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay@netcom.com | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero 408-688-5409 | knowledge, reputations, information markets, W.A.S.T.E.: Aptos, CA | black markets, collapse of governments. Higher Power: 2^756839 | Public Key: PGP and MailSafe available. Note: I put time and money into writing this posting. I hope you enjoy it. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 19:41:32 BST From: jrk@sys.uea.ac.uk (Richard Kennaway) Subject: burglary survival Craig Presson writes: [quotes scheme for converting bathroom into fortress] >I like this plan, except that if someone actually has to fire that >damned handgun it's going to ruin everyone's ears. Add ear plugs to the emergency kit. And suppose the enemy tries to smoke you out? Store a rope ladder by the window, a fire extinguisher, and make sure the bathroom is lined with non-flammable tiles (don't forget the ceiling). Perhaps gas masks to protect against tear gas as well. I'd call this overkill, if that wasn't an unfortunate choice of words in this context. But perhaps I've led an unusually sheltered life. As I said in another message, I've only been burgled once and never felt the immediate need for a weapon. Am I alone in this? -- ____ Richard Kennaway __\_ / School of Information Systems Internet: jrk@sys.uea.ac.uk \ X/ University of East Anglia uucp: ...mcsun!ukc!uea-sys!jrk \/ Norwich NR4 7TJ, U.K. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 93 09:16:34 -0600 From: Todd Steigerwald Subject: Article on E. Drexler & nanotech in DDJ > The Oct 93 issue of Dr. Dobb's Journal has a short (3 1/2 > pages) article on mechanical nanocomputers, in case anyone's > interested. > > Jeff > Please elaborate on the relative availability of this publication. I think I've been in the dark too long, I haven't heard of it. Respectfully, Todd Steigerwald ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1993 14:14:10 -0500 From: cpresson@jido.b30.ingr.com (Craig Presson) Subject: GUNS, SOC: Burglary and countermeasures In <199310071754.AA03191@lachesis.synopsys.com>, Dave Krieger writes: [...] |> For example, suppose that guns were widely owned in the U.S., and that |> their owners are trained to use them properly. (Compared to the U.K., they |> are already widely owned, but I'm talking >50% of the population.) |> Furthermore, suppose _everyone knows_ that this is the gun ownership rate. |> A burglar who knows he has a 50% chance of surprising a homeowner who has a |> gun and knows how to use it (as opposed to the probability today, which is |> low everywhere and practically zero in some jurisdictions) will, if he is |> at all rational, take up some other hobby (I don't care what happens to |> irrational people). |> |> Now, if I own and maintain a gun, I am helping not only myself, I am |> helping my neighbors who don't have guns, because the burglar can't know in |> advance which apartments have guns and which ones don't -- gun ownership |> can be considered a public good in this sense. |> |> The notion that crimes against my property aren't "really" crimes, and that |> a burglar who only wants to quietly and non-violently take away the fruits |> of my labors deserves in some sense to get away with it for being a nice |> non-violent fellow, is, frankly, nonsense. My possessions represent hours |> of my labor -- I worked to earn the money I used to purchase them; days or |> years of my _life_ are crystallized in each object in my home. Burglars |> and murderers are more similar than you realize; they both steal time from |> your life -- the murderer steals future time; the burglar steals time that |> has already passed, by stealing the things for which you traded that time. |> Burglars deserve to be stopped with deadly force as much as murderers or |> armed robbers do. |> dV/dt |> DVDT on HEx |> who has very few sleepness nights |> except when thinking about the FDA Let me check and see if I'm holding enough DVDT. ^ / ------/---- cpresson@ingr.com (Freeman Craig Presson) /AS 5/20/373 PNO; ISGS 9/373; ExI 4/373, NRA 5/373, etc. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1993 15:17:27 -0400 From: "Perry E. Metzger" Subject: burglary survival (was: Extortion Counterm Charlie Stross says: > The house I grew up in (from age 2 to 21) was burgled 18 times. Likely a consequence of the fact that in the U.K. there is virtually no fear of being injured during a burglary. In the US its a risky proposition. I've lived even in reasonably dangerous places and have had one attempted breakin, and one breakin in my car (which yielded the burglars nothing). I live in New York City, which should be a "very high crime" area. > But consider this. Imagine if my father had owned a gun > for self-defense. In the US, handguns are commonly kept > loaded in the bedroom, in case of intrusion. Under such > circumstances, the intruder would have found the gun > _before_ discovering he was not entirely alone in the house. > Already wired on adrenaline from fear of discovery, the > newly armed burglar would have instantly become much more > dangerous -- and instead of fleeing, might have been > sufficiently emboldened to do something stupid. Thats why you keep the gun in a quick release lockbox by the bed. Many of these provide quite reasonable security. You keep the long arms in a gun safe. > Only stupid people burgle houses. If you keep a gun at > home, _please_, for your own sake, make sure you don't > leave it where someone stupid might find it in the > process of conducting a rapid search. You wouldn't > want to give a gun to an idiot, would you? Thats reasonably true. Perry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1993 11:26:06 -0700 From: dkrieger@Synopsys.COM (Dave Krieger) Subject: GUNS,SOC: burglary survival >From: tcmay@netcom.com (Timothy C. May) >Subject: burglary survival >X-Extropian-Date: Remailed on October 7, 373 P.N.O. [18:11:16 UTC] >X-Message-Number: #93-10-295 >Perhaps the fact that most households here in the U.S have guns has ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^ ^^ ^^^ ^^^ ^^^^ ^^^^ >something to do with this apparent disparity in burglary rates? Is this in fact the case? (A pleasant surprise if true. I asserted the opposite in my post, but I admit I was guessing based on anecdotal evidence.) Ahoy, any Gun Nuts(tm) out there, what's the straight skinny on gun ownership statistics? dV/dt (P.S. Speaking of guns, I saw a recent front-page column-one piece in the WSJ about how liberal candidates are making a great deal of political hay by running against the NRA rather than against their opponents... "Vote for Joe Schmo -- he's tough on guns!" Did anyone else see this?) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1993 15:27:46 -0400 (EDT) From: SONIC FURY Subject: burglary survival As a Criminal Justice major, I'd like to interject my view on self-defense. Keeping a gun or guns in the home for protection is a good idea which I do condone. Keeping the gun in a location that may be easily accessable by a burgler shouldn't pose much of a concern, if you follow the guidelines given in any hunter's safety course. Never keep ammo near the weapon. Always keep any ammunition LOCKED in a dresser drawer or shelf of a cabinet, preferably in an adjacent room. Keep in mind the burgler does not know whether or not the gun is loaded or unloaded when he's looking down the barrel. Guns on the person, that I do not advise unless you are a licensed, armed security officer or other licensed, armed law enforcement position. If you gun down a burgler, keep in mind you HAVE COMMITTED A CRIME, unless it's proven beyond a reasonable doubt that you were in jeopardy of life or limb. In most cases, this means the burgler has to display a weapon first. If you walk into your living room, and a man is walking out your backdoor with your VCR, and you decide to shoot, you have just use excessive force and, in most cases, will be tried for murder (or at least manslaughter). It's hard enough for a police officer to justify pulling the trigger, let alone a civillian. There are many non-lethal, and very effective weapons on the market, that require no permit to carry. Mace, stun guns, key chain weapons, and even crowd control grenades can be purchased by the average citizen (at least in PA). Any comments? Sean ------------------------------ End of Extropians Digest V93 #279 *********************************