15 Message 15: From exi@panix.com Tue Jul 27 18:28:22 1993 Return-Path: Received: from usc.edu by chaph.usc.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1+ucs-3.0) id AA15152; Tue, 27 Jul 93 18:28:19 PDT Errors-To: Extropians-Request@gnu.ai.mit.edu Received: from panix.com by usc.edu (4.1/SMI-3.0DEV3-USC+3.1) id AA29498; Tue, 27 Jul 93 18:27:52 PDT Errors-To: Extropians-Request@gnu.ai.mit.edu Received: by panix.com id AA17487 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for more@usc.edu); Tue, 27 Jul 1993 21:24:36 -0400 Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1993 21:24:36 -0400 Message-Id: <199307280124.AA17487@panix.com> To: Exi@panix.com From: Exi@panix.com Subject: Extropians Digest X-Extropian-Date: July 28, 373 P.N.O. [01:23:28 UTC] Reply-To: extropians@gnu.ai.mit.edu Errors-To: Extropians-Request@gnu.ai.mit.edu Status: R Extropians Digest Wed, 28 Jul 93 Volume 93 : Issue 208 Today's Topics: Double Post [1 msgs] FSF: InfoProp [1 msgs] FSF: InfoProp, etc. [1 msgs] FSF: Some Useful Software, No Useful Politics [1 msgs] FSF: Some Useful Software, No Useful Politics [2 msgs] FWD: Seagoing communications experiment [1 msgs] Homosexuality & Genetic Engineering [1 msgs] The Age of Robots [1 msgs] Wage Competition (LONG) [1 msgs] Who is signed up for cryonics [1 msgs] techno-unemployment (yet again and forevermore) [1 msgs] Administrivia: No admin msg. Approximate Size: 61524 bytes. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1993 19:23:19 -0400 From: "Perry E. Metzger" Subject: Who is signed up for cryonics Lefty says: > Be careful about extrapolating from one thing to another, unrelated thing, > Ray. Your documentary-watching would seem to have little bearing on the > issue at hand. We're not talking about young children here. Nor do I view > the experiments with dogs, baboons, earthworms, etc., to be especially > convincing. None of the higher animals were taken down to anything close > to liquid nitrogen temperatures. None, in point of fact, were taken below > freezing. Golden hamsters have been taken below freezing, and have had 30% of the water in their brains converted to ice, and have remained to all appearances completely fine after thawing. However, I think this is unimportant. No one would doubt that given sufficiently advanced technology I could manage to create diamonds the size of the Hope diamond -- never mind that no human has ever managed it. The mere fact that we haven't accomplished the task of constructing cell repair machines yet is not a sufficient argument to convince us that it will always be impossible to repair the fairly clean damage done by freezing to neurons. > Umm, Ray, it says as much in the sci.cryonics FAQ. Do you claim that > freezing does no damage? No one claims freezing does no damage. However, you are making the claim that freezing does so much damage that even given the capacity to make arbitrary manipulations of individual atoms we would be incapable of fixing the damage. The formation of ice crystals in the brain tends to tear open cells. However, the pieces of those cells will not be going anywhere at subfreezing temperatures, and especially not at liquid nitrogen temperatures. As I've noted, experiments HAVE been done that have shown cell structure to be largely intact following freezing -- not capable of spontaneous recovery, but to all appearances reconstructable. If one wall of a house collapses, leaving very large fragments, we do not argue that the house can never be restored to the same appearance. Similarly, if a cell has merely been torn open by ice crystals, we have no real reason to believe that given the capacity to move around individual atoms we could not make good the damage. Now, don't get me wrong -- its POSSIBLE that there is no way to fix this stuff because neurons might behave in some completely unexpected way other than the one indicated by current research. None of this is certain without actually doing it. However, it looks pretty plausible -- certainly not the "easier to reconstruct you with fingernail parings" scenario you seem to believe in. There are also wider scale fractures that occur in the tissue when it is chilled below the glass transition temperature. However, these fractures are remarkably clean, and appear to lose no information either. They occur at a temperature at which the structures in question are completely vitrified. > >> >3) The information needed to reconstruct a functioning brain from > >> > whats frozen seems very likely to all be there. > >> > >> Really? What information would that be, precisely? > > > > The information stored in the brain. Dualism has no scientific validity > >at all unless your a religious nut. > > Ah, that clears it up. The information needed to reconstruct a functioning > brain is the information stored in the brain. Thanks, Ray! Its not a tautology. We can pretty much assume that there is no more information needed to repair the brain than an intact brain would contain. Provided the information from the intact brain has not disappeared -- that is, provided that all that has happened is that the cells have gotten "jigsaw puzzled" a bit, there should be no reason we cannot reconstruct precisely what we had originally. > Surely you can do better than that. Circular reasoning and begging the > question have no religious validity at all unless you're a scientismatic > nut. Would you disagree with the statement "sufficiently rigorous examination of a Ford Model T should allow you to build an exact duplicate"? Saying that "all the information needed to construct a brain is in the brain itself" is no more incorrect. All Ray was saying is that unless there is some mystical intangible soul, your brain is just a mechanism that can be studied and, even if badly damaged, reconstructed provided the original configuration can be inferred from the structure even in its damaged state. > By the way, I _do_ admire the little Medical Alert tags. Do you imagine > that your average $14,000 per annum EMT is going to pay a substantial > degree of attention to 'em? Or do you suppose they're more likely to tag > you, bag you, and ask questions later? Your skepticism is admirable, Lefty, but you seem to forget that this isn't a theoretical. You don't have to ask us if we imagine that they will pay attention -- we know the answer. This isn't some game, Lefty. Many people are in suspension already. Many of them have indeed been found by EMTs, although I don't know what their salaries were. The answer is that they pay attention and call the number on the tags. They are trained to look for Medic Alert tags, you see. One particularly tragic case where they did not pay attention was the lawyer that got shot in the head in the law library a while back, who's tag was only noticed once he got the morgue, but he was not a terribly promising case to begin with. Perry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1993 19:26:20 -0400 From: "Perry E. Metzger" Subject: FSF: Some Useful Software, No Useful Politics Peter Baumbach says: > Ray Cromwell writes: > > Just to add to this. The PPL code on this list already enforces > > a private copyright mechanism. Pandit Singh was the first person > > to break it. Like I said in another message, future software > > copyright is likely to be enforced via tit-for-tat. Right now, > > software is largely self contained but in the future when > > everything is networked and information is more distributed, > > software copyright can be enforced by ostracization. There is no > > need for state coercion. > > Suppose a third party read some of the illegally(PPL) copied messages. > They are not a subscriber to this list. They did not agree to the PPL. > Does this mean they can copy the message and do with it what they wish? Depends on how the rest of the world works. The list PPL is not particularly effective because it doesn't mesh in with the rest of the world's legal system. > Someone remind me. What is the best source to read up on Privately > Produced Law? Try "The Enterprise of Law: Justice without the State" by Bruce Benson. Perry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1993 19:33:32 -0400 From: "Perry E. Metzger" Subject: Wage Competition (LONG) FutureNerd Steve Witham says: > dkrieger@synopsys.com (Dave Krieger) sez- > > > Grrrr. Steve, I dislike your writing style, because you heap multiple > > implicit assumptions into every sentence. > > Sorry to irritate. I'm doing this at work and trying to address one > point at a time. Personally I like this style of interaction. > Thanks for questioning my assumptions; that was the idea. > > By the way, a little context: my goal is to try to figure a way for > humans to survive past the advent of "true AI." Trying to enslave them > seems like hanging on by fingernails over an abyss--a real losing > proposition. "Enslaved" intelligences are nothing new -- arguably large parts of your brain are in fact "enslaved" intelligences. I don't see why humans might not survive past the advent of true AI. Certainly roaches survived the advent of humans -- and it is commonly believed we are smarter than them. Roaches haven't suffered as a result of the rise of humans, either. I'll agree that it will be not necessarily be possible to lead an exciting life in the post AI world if you don't do something in the way of self transformation like uploading yourself, but then again, its hard to lead an exciting life in the modern world if you refuse to use any gadgets invented since 1900. Perry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jul 93 16:34:44 PDT From: thamilto@pcocd2.intel.com (Tony Hamilton - FES ERG~) Subject: FSF: Some Useful Software, No Useful Politics > To enforce a patent, I have to be able to initiate force against THIRD > PARTIES, that is, people who were not party to the initial contract. A > patent does not merely restrict people I tell about my invention from > using it -- it also restricts people who merely come up with the idea > on their own. (first reminding everyone that I am _not_ arguing for patents, or against them for that matter): Your point, then, Perry, is that you don't have to initiate force against third parties to enforce a copyright? This is absurd. I am party A, with song I wrote, which I intend to "copyright". If I want to publicly play this song, how the hell do I arrange for contracts with everyone who might listen to it? If one of those people records and sells the song, my attempt to enforce my copyright would certainly be action against a 3rd party, since that person never signed a contract. How about a book? I write a book. Let's just say that now I draw up a copyright contract (which I believe is what you are talking about) with each person I sell the book to. Fine. Let us say Fred (any resemblance to any Freds out there is unintentional) bought my book, and signed a contract which requires Fred to never copy or sell copies of my book. What happens when Fred's friend Olaf reads the book, borrows it, copies it, and sells it? Do I go after Fred? Okay, maybe the contract specifically stated that Fred was not allowed to let others read or copy/sell the book. What if Olaf is a thief and steals the book? Olaf then mass-distributes copies of the book. Even if I _still_ go after Fred, so what? There are now an untold number of _my_ books out on the market. How can I now enforce my copyright? None of the people who owns those books signed a contract with me. Do I place a lien on everything Fred owns for all those books sold as a result of his negligence in letting it be sold? Do I kill Fred? Does it make a difference? As you see, none of this deals with someone else inventing the same book or the same song on their own (which would be a reasonable event in the case of patents according to many). So, I ask you again, how can contracts be applied to copyrights, and then enforced? (and I am not challenging here. I simply fail to see your logic. If you can show me the error in mine, at least I'd then understand your point. It may be that I'm just missing some key point.) Tony Hamilton thamilto@pcocd2.intel.com HAM on HEX ------------------------------ Date: 27 Jul 93 16:42:38 U From: "Kent Hastings" Subject: FSF: InfoProp FSF: InfoProp#000# Perry: >> Why not just have them sign a restrictive contract with you? >> Why do you need this artificial notion of "intellectual >> property"? Elias Israel: > If you could get a contract to exchange it in a free market, > it must be property. If what you're exchanging is an idea, > it's *intellectual property.* As Schulman says in his pro-informational property rights essay "Logorights": If a thing can be copied, then it is a thing. But just because an information object (like the color green) can be identified, doesn't mean it is able to be owned like a car or some land. I can make the color of a T-shirt a contract requirement: "I hereby purchase a green T-shirt." If I open the package and see a red T-shirt instead, I would be a victim of fraud. You might say that color is a "property" of the T-shirt, but this doesn't mean anyone can own a color. > Why is it that every time I use the phrase "intellectual > property," you think I'm talking about the law? Because you don't use a natural rights argument, but a legal arbitrary whim worshipping "software patents ought to be shorter (!!)" LAW argument. You get what you argue for. Kent - kent_hastings@qmail2.aero.org. ------------------------------ Date: 27 Jul 93 16:42:35 U From: "Kent Hastings" Subject: FSF: InfoProp, etc. FSF: InfoProp, etc.#000# Perry: >> Why not just have them sign a restrictive contract with you? >> Why do you need this artificial notion of "intellectual >> property"? Elias Israel: > If you could get a contract to exchange it in a free market, > it must be property. If what you're exchanging is an idea, > it's *intellectual property.* As Schulman says in his pro-informational property rights essay "Logorights": If a thing can be copied, then it is a thing. But just because an information object (like the color green) can be identified, doesn't mean it is able to be owned like a car or some land. I can make the color of a T-shirt a contract requirement: "I hereby purchase a green T-shirt." If I open the package and see a red T-shirt instead, I would be a victim of fraud. You might say that color is a "property" of the T-shirt, but this doesn't mean anyone can own a color. > Why is it that every time I use the phrase "intellectual > property," you think I'm talking about the law? Because you don't use a natural rights argument, but a legal arbitrary whim worshipping "software patents ought to be shorter (!!)" LAW argument. You get what you argue for. Kent - kent_hastings@qmail2.aero.org. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1993 19:47:09 -0400 From: "Perry E. Metzger" Subject: techno-unemployment (yet again and forevermore) FutureNerd Steve Witham says: > > I've mentioned about three times now that all that matters is > > comparative advantage and not actual productivity -- it makes no > > difference if the machine can out pace you provided you and the > > machine have different relative rates of production. Is no one > > listening? > > > > Perry > > I've been listening but I'm intimidated by the possible term-of- > artness of "comparative advantage." So off with timidity... > > As I see it, the problem is productivity as a function of cost of > living. If I can only make too-limited value out of the matter and > energy it takes to sustain me (compared to what others could do > with it) then I can't afford to eat. This is obviously true for > non-uploads, but maybe even true for uploads--the virtual circuit > patterns might still be very inefficient. I am a better typist than my secretary. I am also better at filling out forms, answering the phone, and indeed everything my secretary does. So -- why does it pay for me to have a secretary? The answer is comparative advantage. Comparative advantage is the reason that economies work. What matters when entities trade is NOT absolute productivity. It is the ratio of productivities. As an example, lets take the free trade example. Lets say, in the US, a worker can produce a TV in two hours and a bicycle in one hour. Assume, foolishly, that labor is the only cost. Lets say that in Mexico, a worker can produce a TV in 24 hours and a bicycle in six hours. So, we have the following interesting situation -- bicycles are produced at six times the cost in labor in Mexico, and yet it pays to import bicycles from Mexico. (Try seeing what the effect of arbitraging the price of bikes and TVs is in your head if you don't believe this.) The situation with my secretary is analagous -- our productivity ratios are different. I can do something with the time I'd spend filing forms that I'm relatively more productive at than my secretary. The situation with AIs and humans might very well end up being analagous. Its highly unlikely that they would have precisely the same ratio of productivities as humans, and therefore are unlikely to see no profit in trade. Similarly for all other arguments about how automation will throw everyone out of work. Productivity has risen by thousands of times in the last two centuries, and yet remarkably most everyone is still employed. Perry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1993 19:53:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Harry Shapiro Subject: The Age of Robots In reading Hans most interesting post, and Robin's comments, I thought I would add a few of my own. The state of affairs by the end of chapter 4, and in the start of chapter 5 is about as perfect an Extropian ideal as I can imagine. [I would think the the author had been reading the Extropians list for the last year or two ;) Also, perhaps in error, I note a similarity between "Exes" and the abbreviation of my favorite institute, ExI.] The early part of chapter 4 is where I had a problem; the problem being that society being depicted is not the sort of society I would wish to live in. As scenario's go, I would say that it is in plausible, given the continuing increase in productivity Hans indicated. If such events would allow me to become an "Ex" I would be thrilled. Still I am worried about the increases in taxation depicted. My fear is that it is equally plausible that such increases in taxation would either 1) kill all incentive for technological advancements leading to a technological decline or 2) that a technological decline would be combined with strong political suppression leading to an "end state" not unlike feudal serfdom. /hawk -- Harry S. Hawk habs@extropy.org Electronic Communications Officer, Extropy Institute Inc. The Extropians Mailing List, Since 1991 EXTROPY -- A measure of intelligence, information, energy, vitality, experience, diversity, opportunity, and growth. EXTROPIANISM -- The philosophy that seeks to increase extropy. ------------------------------ Date: 27 Jul 93 16:55:19 U From: "Kent Hastings" Subject: Double Post Double Post#000# Sorry about the double posting, the Mail software here didn't show me any outgoing mail for a while, then BANGO! A whole buncha messages appeared, including things I sent twice, thinking the first one failed to get through. Kent - kent_hastings@qmail2.aero.org. Hopefully, our move to Microsoft Mail from QuickMail will improve the ease of use for me. It will definitely change my internet address, though. Real Soon Now. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jul 93 19:51:50 EDT From: fnerd@smds.com (FutureNerd Steve Witham) Subject: Homosexuality & Genetic Engineering > >From _The Age_ 26/7/93: > > Jews to study controversial genetics plan > London, Monday. > > The advisory cabinet of the Chief Rabbi of Britain, Dr. > Jonathan Sacks, will be urged this spring to allow Jews to *THE* Dr. Jonathan Sacks!? > undergo voluntary genetic engineering to remove homosexual > tendencies if this becomes scientifically possible. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1993 20:08:43 -0400 From: "Perry E. Metzger" Subject: FSF: Some Useful Software, No Useful Politics Tony Hamilton - FES ERG~ says: > > To enforce a patent, I have to be able to initiate force against THIRD > > PARTIES, that is, people who were not party to the initial contract. A > > patent does not merely restrict people I tell about my invention from > > using it -- it also restricts people who merely come up with the idea > > on their own. > > (first reminding everyone that I am _not_ arguing for patents, or against > them for that matter): Your point, then, Perry, is that you don't have > to initiate force against third parties to enforce a copyright? This is > absurd. I am party A, with song I wrote, which I intend to "copyright". If > I want to publicly play this song, how the hell do I arrange for contracts > with everyone who might listen to it? If one of those people records and > sells the song, my attempt to enforce my copyright would certainly be action > against a 3rd party, since that person never signed a contract. Well, one could try, but it isn't actually necessary. One can construct a customary legal system that can stop this sort of action without that sort of problem, much as our current common law trade secret system stops third parties who gained illegitimate access to trade secrets. The doctrine involved is this: the third party has gained access to the information from someone who did not have legitimate rights to give you the information. In other words, you are gaining access to something via the fruit of a poisoned tree. One might argue that one's own transaction was seemingly legitimate, but so might the receiver of a stolen car who believes he is legitimately renting it. The big difference between this form of pseudocopyright or trade secret protection and the notion of patents is again the question of by what path one gained access to the information in question. A patent in theory restricts people who have lived their entire lives in an isolation chamber and have know way of having received information from you by any means, direct or indirect. Trade secret and similar protections operate on the notion of contractual obligations and their fulfillment or lack thereof. > How about a book? I write a book. Let's just say that now I draw up a > copyright contract (which I believe is what you are talking about) with > each person I sell the book to. Fine. Let us say Fred (any resemblance to > any Freds out there is unintentional) bought my book, and signed a contract > which requires Fred to never copy or sell copies of my book. What happens > when Fred's friend Olaf reads the book, borrows it, copies it, and sells > it? Do I go after Fred? Depends on what your contract with Frd says. If the contract with Fred doesn't state or imply any restrictions on what he can do with the book, then you can't go after him. If it does imply restrictions, then presumably you can. > What if Olaf is a thief and steals the book? Olaf then > mass-distributes copies of the book. Even if I _still_ go after > Fred, so what? You can't go after Fred since he is blameless -- he did not do anything to fail to uphold his end of the contract. If I am obliged by contract to deliver to you a painting on monday and someone steals it I am not in breech of contract for not delivering. However, then the question of Olaf arises. Olaf gained access to the materials in question in an illegitimate manner -- as you note, he stole them. He gained possession of the items without the consent of anyone involved, and he did so by an initiation of force, specifically, theft of the book -- the physical book is doubtless property. The chain of legitimate possession would seem to have been breeched, and presumably Olaf can be sued for damages, on the same basis that you could sue him for damages if he struck your car or raped your wife or otherwise did something illegitimate. I'll admit that some things are not as pleasantly clear as one would like them to be, but there are always going to be such instances in law. Take, for example, the question of the unknowing transfer of stolen property. Perry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jul 93 23:05:41 BST From: whitaker@eternity.demon.co.uk (Russell E. Whitaker) Subject: FWD: Seagoing communications experiment Forwarded message follows: > From wordy@ucsd.edu Mon Jul 26 08:05:18 1993 > Received: from post.demon.co.uk by eternity.demon.co.uk with SMTP > id AA10285 ; Mon, 26 Jul 93 08:04:53 GMT > Received: from ucsd.edu by post.demon.co.uk id aa23460; 25 Jul 93 22:35 BST > Received: from celece.ucsd.edu by ucsd.edu; id AA26926 > sendmail 5.67/UCSD-2.2-sun via SMTP > Sun, 25 Jul 93 14:35:26 -0700 for whitaker@eternity.demon.co.uk > Received: from [132.239.19.248] (ece1mac16.UCSD.EDU) by celece (4.1/UCSDPSEUDO.4) > id AA26107 for whitaker@eternity.demon.co.uk; Sun, 25 Jul 93 14:35:07 PDT > Date: Sun, 25 Jul 93 14:35:05 PDT > Message-Id: <9307252135.AA26107@celece> > To: whitaker@eternity.demon.co.uk > From: Steve Roberts > X-Sender: wordy@celece.ucsd.edu (Unverified) > Subject: Microship prospectus > Status: R >Microship? Is this sea-going? If you have one, please send me >a textfile describing it! Sounds intruiging! SEA MOSS MICROSHIP Project Status Report June 28, 1993 Steven K. Roberts Nomadic Research Labs Brief Background It has been nearly 10 years since I launched myself from Columbus, Ohio on what was expected to be an 18-month high-tech recumbent bicycle tour around the United States, linked to friends and publishers via online networks. What I did not anticipate was the resulting three-way symbiosis of sponsors, media, and the project itself: the original Winnebiko was rebuilt into the Winnebiko II in 1986, and then, after 3.5 years of work in Silicon Valley with the help of 140 sponsors and some 45 volunteers, into the current system known as BEHEMOTH. This machine, estimated at $1.2 million, has covered over 17,000 miles around America (plus nearly 75,000 in trade show, media, and speaking tours, hauled inside a mobile lab known as the Mothership). This is a strangely successful enterprise, but it is time for change. Lured inexorably by water, I am now developing a new system: the Sea Moss Microship, a kayak-trimaran that embodies the mission-critical subsystems of BEHEMOTH while optimized for the challenging environment of full-time aquatic adventure. This document, a regularly updated project status report, outlines my current concept of the Microship system and summarizes work in progress. If you want additional background on BEHEMOTH, copies of media coverage, or detailed technical information about any aspect of "high-tech nomadness," please contact me directly: Steve Roberts email: wordy@ucsd.edu Microship lab: 619-534-2495 base office: PO Box 2185, El Segundo, CA 90245 (310-322-1655) Microship Overview As the foregoing suggests, Microship extends the design principles of BEHEMOTH -- which can be very loosely summarized as a human/solar- powered mobile workstation designed to render my physical location irrelevant. The bike is equipped with Mac, DOS, and SPARC environments, a satellite electronic mail link, cellular phone with modem and fax, handlebar chord keyboard and ultrasonic head mouse, helmet-mounted display, a complete ham radio station that includes digital modes, speech I/O, and much more, all controlled by a network of embedded FORTH processors and carried on a 105-speed custom recumbent bicycle pulling a solar-roofed trailer. The new project is an aquatic version of this, significantly updated to represent the capabilities of 1993-1995 technology. Current status, as of the date of this report, is that I have moved into a lab at the University of California, San Diego, and a shop at the Scripps Institution of Oceanography, institutions that are jointly hosting the project. With the help of Scripps oceanographers, UCSD engineering faculty, a team of students from multiple departments, and over 100 industry partners and sponsors, I will spend the next two years bringing the Microship project to fruition -- then launch in 1995 for a few years of open-ended adventure linked to the network more tightly than ever before. Much of this connectivity is devoted to the original objective of maintaining stable publishing and personal relationships while traveling full-time. This is no small matter: most serious travelers report loneliness, inability to remain current with news and industry developments, poor productivity, and homesickness as serious side-effects of being on the move for years. I have already solved these problems by depending on the network connections to move my perception of stability into "Dataspace," and the new project will extend this metaphor by radically increasing both communication channel bandwidth and the sophistication of front-end software tools. But new motives have surfaced as well. The Microship will carry a suite of environmental data collection sensors, and will transmit telemetry blocks via the Internet to schools, an Internet ftp server, and BEHEMOTH in its new home at the Computer Museum in Boston. While I am not pretending to perform any kind of comprehensive survey, this will nevertheless yield interesting data for education, with potential spin-offs in the form of RF-linked data collection packages useful for local analysis of environmental conditions. The remainder of this document describes the current state of Microship design... Hull and Mechanical After exploring a number of configurations and brainstorming with naval architects, kayak designers, sailors, and mechanical engineers, Microship overall design has stabilized into a human/solar/sail-propelled trimaran consisting of three sea kayaks -- a large, beamy double (about 22') for the center hull, and two sleek singles (about 17') for the amas, or outriggers. These are linked by solar panel arrays totaling 664 watts (about 7/8 hp) of capacity in full sun, occupying approximately 4x8' on each side plus packaging overhead. If you envision a big double kayak with mainsail, jib, and Macintosh, joined to a pair of medium sea kayaks by a couple of folding solar ping-pong tables, then you have a rough idea of the general plan. Numerous hatches and sealed equipment bays in all hulls provide adequate space for packs, comm/nav gear, desalinator and water tank, food storage, tools, and so on. Given the stresses encountered in rough seas, the composite layup will be considerably stronger than that of a normal lightweight kayak, with special attention to stress transition areas surrounding the attachment points for the stainless steel folding beam assemblies. Figure 1: Microship plan view, rough sketch. The arrangement of hatches (H) and other fixtures is not yet fully defined, but a possible design is shown here for scale (the main point of this drawing is to show overall architecture, not details of hull shape or deck layout). The solar arrays fold along their centerlines and can be retracted to rest atop the outer hulls in rough weather. Small ovals on either side of the main cockpit are rudder/keyboard handles, and the dark circle forward of the main equipment bay is the mast step (integrated with the beam assembly, not the kayak deck). The passenger seat as drawn would be a wet and microwave-rich ride -- we are currently juggling the trade-offs of various deck plan options to accommodate performance, equipment accessibility, mode changes, trim, and aesthetics... this is NOT the final design. (Beam shown here is slightly over 15 feet, and LOA is about 24 feet including thruster.) This architecture offers a number of features and operating modes: 1. Normal. The boat will be extremely stable, allowing easy movement among hatches and cockpits. In a standard kayak, retrieving gear from a hatch is a risky operation -- this will be more like a floating platform. Controlled flexion in the outrigger arms will prevent excessive stress in rough seas. 2. Compressed. To fit into berths and between narrowly spaced bridge supports, the solar structures can be "accordioned" and the hulls juxtaposed by folding a spring-loaded stainless steel support frame, yielding an 8-foot beam. 3. Water Bivouac. Conditions may force alternative overnight accommodations: the solar surfaces will be backed by a composite aluminum honeycomb panel strong enough to support human weight. Two rectangular dome tents will fit on these surfaces, linked by a "hallway" covering the main console area. 4. Storm. In heavy weather, there is reason to be concerned about large flat surfaces, especially when heavy swell can momentarily close off one end and create a high-pressure air pocket. The solar panels will fold independently of the outrigger support structure to minimize the impact of wind and dumping seas. 5. Base Camp. With its shallow draft, the boat will be ideally suited to beach camping, when the two smaller kayaks can be disconnected to provide seaworthy vehicles for local exploration or errands. 6. Emergency Dinghy. The flexibility of this design allows either kayak to be disconnected at sea and paddled ashore for a surf landing (or used for escape in the event of catastrophic damage to the main hull). In surf conditions dangerous to a multihull, all components can be disconnected, linked by lines, and hauled in (the honeycomb-backed solar panels will float) after the main hull is surfed to shore. This spectacle is reserved for emergencies only... 7. Road. Finally, the realities of full-time nomadics dictate frequent visits to companies and host sites. The three hulls will nest in a triangle, with all-terrain wheels and a carriage assembly to allow towing behind a vehicle or, for modest distances, the human pilot(s) linked by yoke and hitch. The main hull will have a custom deck plan, though the singles should be more or less standard with the exception of outrigger-support fixtures and antennae. In front of the main cockpit, a raised console (pressurized to protect the electronics from seawater incursion) will carry Mac, video, and control system LCDs, as well as the Marine VHF panel and a small cluster of switches and status displays. The bulk of the electronics will be in a sealed pressurized hatch, communicating with the console systems via the on-board network. Other major deck fixtures include whip antennas, a radome for the satellite earth station, GPS antenna, a glass video turret, speakers, lights, drogue, compass, and the usual suite of survival and safety features such as grablines and cleats. Propulsion is based on three power sources. First, on sunny days, the 664-watt solar array will provide approximately 50 pounds of thrust from a resting state, yielding cruising speed estimated in the 4-5 knot range via a thruster integrated with the rudder assembly. Power can also be provided by two sets of pedals linked to efficient generators, yielding 100-125 watts per person. While this is about 25% less efficient than a direct mechanical linkage, the weight and complexity are dramatically reduced (and integration with the power management system allows battery recharging using human power under any conditions). Finally, a sail rig can be deployed to allow conventional wind power -- the configuration of this is yet unknown, though three alternatives of appropriate scale are under consideration (roller-furling loose-footed mainsail and jib, windsurfer rigs, or Balogh kayak sails). Electronics packaging will depend heavily upon a few tricks to minimize the impact of the fiercely corrosive seawater environment (dubbed "aqua regia" by some). The control console and main equipment bay will operate at about 3 psi above ambient, provided by a small electric pump (with a Schrader valve for manual bicycle-pump backup) followed by a desiccant cartridge and fine- mesh filter. The intent here is to prevent the enclosures from thermally breathing moist, salt-laden air in the event of a leak -- they will outgas and sound an alarm when the control system notices pressure drop uncorrelated with temperature change. Eventually the desiccant will become saturated, and I'll dry it over the camp stove. Related packaging issues affect every part of the design, and we will make liberal use of undersea connectors, sealed or potted subassemblies, and a mineral-oil bath for components that need to be serviceable but don't justify inclusion in the pressurization system. (One of the nice things about working with oceanographers at Scripps is that they have already developed effective solutions to these problems...) Computer Systems and Applications This is an area that involves extensive detail, but for purposes of this overview I will keep it at the summary level. Basically, there are two classes of computers on board -- the high-level systems and the low-level control network. At the high level, the primary system will be a repackaged Macintosh PowerBook (with active-matrix screen, possibly color). The keyboard in the rudder control grips (or split-QWERTY, to be determined) and a sealed pointing device will provide text entry and cursor control, and Digital Ocean's wireless spread-spectrum AppleTalk link will connect Microship computers to the one in my backpack. The second cockpit may contain a Mac as well to support the work of my traveling companion. Macintosh applications include Eudora for electronic mail (via cellular phone and satellite), networking tools, Word for text and publications, ACT! database management linked to maps via GeoQuery, project planning tools, AutoCAD, MacDraw Pro, navigation and charting, language training, and demonstration software. This system, like its counterpart on BEHEMOTH, will be my home operating environment and link to the world. Unlike BEHEMOTH, however, the Macintosh will not be essential to the operation of the low-level control system. On the bike, I did this to present a graphic user interface (HyperTalk layered atop FORTH), and although the Mac will still allow a pleasant work environment for all levels of the Microship system, it will not be necessary for basic operation. (Although it would reduce console real-estate by eliminating a second screen, using the Mac as the front- end for continuous-duty control negatively impacts the power budget, increases complexity, and introduces dangerous single-point failure potential in a critical survival area.) Instead, a second, low-power LCD screen will be managed by one of the microcontrollers on the control network, yielding a continuous display of navigation, safety, status, and environmental data: o Latitude and longitude, waypoints, heading, & other nav data o Air and water temperatures o Radiation, salinity, pH, turbidity, depth, and trim o Equipment bay pressure and temperature o Barometric pressure, with trend data o Time of day and stopwatch o Battery status and estimated time-to-full or time-to-empty o Power control map, local bus voltages, load and charge currents o Drinking water level and desalinator status o Security system status and self-test o Propulsion system performance and load-share o Marine radar detected o Communication system virtual front panel o Processor and control system self-diagnostics One of the design characteristics that made BEHEMOTH rather too complex was the presence of three separate equipment bays (console, RUMP, and trailer). Each imposed considerable overhead in terms of shock-isolated packaging, power distribution, local control, cabling, and audio/serial networking. While the resulting design is architecturally fascinating, the system is intimidating in scope and documentation is a nightmare. The Microship will be much simpler, with only one equipment bay and one straightforward network of microcontrollers. A single power distribution bus will suffice, and all I/O returns to the same header in the central pressurized hatch. All audio will be routed through one of the crosspoint boards developed for BEHEMOTH, and random serial communications will be handled likewise. The low-level control network consists of about 8 processors, linked to a single hub that supports the display screen and can be addressed directly by the console keyboard. (We're trying to choose the architecture now, with options including Echelon Neuron chips, multidrop, or the familiar serial crosspoint.) These little processors handle power management, propulsion control, environmental data collection, diagnostics, security, keyboard steering, audio networking, transceiver front-ends, navigation sensors, event scheduling, and other essential details. Speaking of user interface, this project will again differ significantly from its predecessor. I may use a chord keyboard on the rudder controls as noted a moment ago, though I'm also considering a waterproof QWERTY keyboard, split in half and mounted on a pair of sliding armrests that control the rudder. This is faster and simpler to use, and if packaging constraints permit, would be preferable. Cursor control will no longer be an ultrasonic head mouse, since I have no intention of wearing a helmet (brain interface unit) while on the water. I'm seeking a waterproof trackball, or may use the Measurement Systems torque joystick currently on hand. Communications As with BEHEMOTH, the communication links to the outside world are critical -- even more so, given the survival issues associated with being on the water. In addition to the EPIRB for life-threatening emergencies, the Microship will carry a full ham radio station, marine VHF, satellite email terminal, cellular phone with modem and fax, security pager, and voice and data links to the backpacks of both crew. Additionally, new wireless mail services are severing the ties even further and will be explored as they become available... The Internet connection is central to the success of this project: Dataspace is my hometown, allowing me to maintain a suite of business and personal relationships absolutely independent of physical location. The high-reliability mail path is via the Qualcomm OmniTRACS terminal, a KU- band uplink to the GSTAR satellite. This acquires and then tracks the geosynchronous bird even while the Microship is in motion, and extensive custom software (written for the BEHEMOTH project by Qualcomm) allows it to appear to the Mac's mail system (Eudora) as a modem, passing messages to and from the Internet via a SPARCstation located at the satellite hub in San Diego. The system even stamps all outgoing messages with my latitude and longitude, which, although not as precise as the GPS navigation system, adds a level of comfort and security to open-water travel. A mapping program can display my location in real time (at the Computer Museum, my base office, Qualcomm, UCSD, Scripps, and other places). This is a slow mail path, however, useful primarily for high-priority short messages. Longer transfers, such as manuscript file transmissions, JPEG images, and the day's routine mail (typically 60-80 messages), will take place through a high-speed modem attached to the cellular phone, new wireless email services, or hardwired connection at a host's site. Conveniently, both this and the satellite use the same mail program on the Macintosh, keeping the user interface consistent. The bike has a SPARC with PPP via cellular... a bicycle with an IP address! This may be an option here as well to support more advanced net services than email. The third data path is via ham radio -- packet and other digital protocols. A widely supported RF-linked network is in place, offering reasonably high reliability for non-business or emergency traffic, with AMTOR and PACTOR allowing worldwide email gateways to the internet via the on-board Icom 725 HF transceiver and multimode TNC. VHF packet is via a PacComm Handi-Packet, which will also allow control/security messaging via a backpack palmtop. In addition to data communication, the Microship will be provided with extensive voice capability, with a VHF marine radio as well as HF, VHF, and UHF amateur equipment. A major design goal here is to have 100% probability of being to reach someone somewhere, at any time from anywhere. (The EPIRB should assure that... one flick of the switch in an emergency and the Microship will look like a 5-alarm fire to the coast guard.) Finally, security is very much a communications issue -- most of the responses to security violations (proximity, motion, shock, lat-long change without a password, unauthorized hatch access, and so on) involve some combination of paging me, transmitting help messages into the Net via satellite, or calling 911 via cellular phone and delivering an emergency voice message. Power Generation and Management With 664 watts of solar panels and some 300 watts of pedaling capacity split between two people, there is a significant resource-management issue here. Efficiency suggests running the array and thruster at 48 volts and then DC-DC converting that down to charge the main 12-volt system battery, but simplicity may rule and dictate fat cables and high-current connectors. In any case, a one of the microcontrollers will be dedicated to active management of power distribution, the percentage available for propulsion, and battery condition. Power distribution throughout the Microship will be modeled exactly after BEHEMOTH: A battery bus (overload protected) runs to all sites, with local software-controlled FETs and switching regulators associated with each load. Manual switching to high-reliability loads, like bilge pump and lights, will be provided to prevent a software crash from becoming a life-threatening situation, and a "JATO" mode will devote everything, including battery, to the thruster when I need to scoot out of the way of a freighter in the fog. A continuous task on the power manager will be observation of battery status and prediction of time to full or empty based on observed performance. A graphic map of the power distribution system can also be displayed to aid in diagnostics and task planning, with some automatic load shedding to provide a graceful degradation of service as the battery level dips below normal levels. Audio/video components In the past, my primary tool for capturing and publishing the essence of this nomadic experience has been text -- using the handlebar keyboard and on- board computers to write stories which were then transmitted electronically to publishers. On this next journey, I will add high-quality audio and video capability to allow pre-production of radio programs, publication of digitally transmitted still video frames, and capture of live video for later editing. All this has to be smoothly integrated with the Microship system -- fumbling below deck for the camcorder is unacceptable in the heat of battle. An audio recorder will be remote-controllable, with stereo microphone near the console, and a miniature video camera will be mounted in a glass turret on deck. Beyond this, I don't know the details... I assume that a waterproofed Hi-8 system is the hardware of choice, with hooks to a tiny headband-mounted camera and other sources. As noted earlier, all audio is routed throughout the system via a software- controlled crosspoint matrix. This essentially allows anything to talk to anything -- speech synthesizer, cellular phone, ham radio, MIDI system, entertainment audio, boom mic headset, marine radio, tape recorder, intercom to backpack, etc. Maximum generality is the key to the hardware design. Safety and survival systems Finally, there's the matter of staying alive. This is much more of a challenge on the water than on the road, with one very significant threat (drunk drivers) replaced by another (drunk powerboaters). In addition to that, we have to deal with dehydration, drowning, hypothermia, cold shock, sharks, storms, surf landings, freighters in the dark, getting lost, hull damage, coral reefs, sickness, clapotis, and williwaws. No single technology can take care of all that, of course, but the Microship will be designed to maximize my chances of survival over the next few years. For visibility, strobe and bi-color marker lights will be built into the deck and mast, with LED taillights on the stern for land mode. The usual flare/smoke/dye kit will facilitate rescue operations, and electronically- launched rockets (wax-sealed fireworks?) may be mounted in a small fixture to alert a rapidly-closing vessel to my low-profile existence if they're ignoring my radar reflection, flashing lights, and urgent shouts on Channel 16. A reverse-osmosis desalinization system will provide fresh drinking water, which not only keeps the human engine hydrated but also serves as the coolant for the helmet heat exchanger I currently use on the bike (Life Support Systems). This can pull approximately 75 watts of waste heat from my body, minimizing performance derating under conditions of elevated ambient temperature. Naturally, a full complement of wilderness camping gear, including cooking and medical supplies, will provide survival tools when I'm not in range of support facilities. This is expected to be a more frequent need in the Microship than it was on BEHEMOTH, since only in the wild west have I encountered situations where essential services are often out of pedaling range. On water, this will be much more common -- with the worst-case scenario being the need to lie to a drogue off a lee shore and camp at sea in a storm. Water Bivouac mode, as well as the ability to squirm down into the hull and under cover, should make this survivable (though not a very pleasant way to spend the night). Any discussion of safety has to include maintenance issues: a full repair kit, including fiberglass patching, electronics diagnostics, and basic mechanical tools will be aboard to keep everything running smoothly and, presumably, afloat. Summary This brief overview is intended to provide a snapshot of the project's current status, and will be expanded considerably in The Nomadness Notes (free via Internet) or The Nomadness Report newsletter (if you are a sponsor, issues will be mailed to you automatically; otherwise, please contact me for subscription information). As I mentioned earlier, I have just established the new laboratory at Scripps/UCSD and am looking forward to having a team of engineering students working on the Microship as a multidisciplinary project platform. There are all sorts of things yet to be determined: autopilot design, sail plan and appendages, rudder/thruster integration, network architecture, user interface, beam assembly design, the flexible-vs-rigid trade-off in outrigger structure, inventory of hand-held back-up equipment, and much more. Stand by for further details as this develops into the fourth phase of high-tech nomadness! Thanks for your interest, and cheers from the road... Steve Roberts ------------------------------ End of Extropians Digest V93 #208 ********************************* & h 4 habs@panix.com Tue Jul 27 06:42 39/1285 Extropy Org 11 whitaker@eternity.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 27 16:14 48/1821 Re: new domain please: ec > 15 Exi@panix.com Tue Jul 27 18:28 1097/52689 Extropians Digest N 16 habs@panix.com Tue Jul 27 18:53 54/2008 Extropy Definition (fwd) N 17 habs@gnu.ai.mit.edu Tue Jul 27 20:03 41/1314 Re: Extropy question. N 18 jamie@netcom.com Tue Jul 27 22:50 29/1057 interview N 19 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 02:34 851/40051 Extropians Digest N 20 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 08:43 975/47292 Extropians Digest N 21 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 08:44 1068/49951 Extropians Digest N 22 desilets@sj.ate.slb.com Wed Jul 28 09:38 45/1538 RESCHEDULED !!! Extropian N 23 dkrieger@Synopsys.COM Wed Jul 28 11:19 31/1481 Naomi Reynolds N 24 dkrieger@Synopsys.COM Wed Jul 28 11:52 44/1863 Information on ExI needed N 25 salsbury@netcom.com Wed Jul 28 11:54 164/7602 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] N 26 habs@panix.com Wed Jul 28 12:27 177/8289 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] N 27 betsys@cs.umb.edu Wed Jul 28 12:46 23/874 distribution of Extropian N 28 iguana@Athena.MIT.EDU Wed Jul 28 14:34 16/674 N 29 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 15:00 916/43591 Extropians Digest N 30 wt@ptolemy.arc.nasa.gov Wed Jul 28 20:58 32/1465 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] N 31 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 21:19 1022/43530 Extropians Digest N 32 Exi@panix.com Thu Jul 29 04:21 917/44638 Extropians Digest & d15 & 16 Message 16: From habs@panix.com Tue Jul 27 18:53:09 1993 Return-Path: Received: from usc.edu by chaph.usc.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1+ucs-3.0) id AA16292; Tue, 27 Jul 93 18:52:59 PDT Received: from panix.com by usc.edu (4.1/SMI-3.0DEV3-USC+3.1) id AA00275; Tue, 27 Jul 93 18:52:51 PDT Received: by panix.com id AA20898 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for more@usc.edu); Tue, 27 Jul 1993 21:52:41 -0400 From: Harry Shapiro Message-Id: <199307280152.AA20898@panix.com> Subject: Extropy Definition (fwd) To: more@usc.edu (Max More) Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1993 21:52:41 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: habs@panix.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1287 Status: R a conscious being, Carol Moore wrote: >From cmoore@cap.gwu.edu Tue Jul 27 16:51:41 1993 Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1993 20:51:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Carol Moore Subject: Extropy Definition To: Harry Shapiro In-Reply-To: <199307271847.AA25900@panix.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Tue, 27 Jul 1993, Harry Shapiro wrote: > EXTROPY -- A measure of intelligence, information, energy, vitality, > experience, diversity, opportunity, and growth. EXTROPIANISM -- The > philosophy that seeks to increase extropy. Of course, it is a measure which is opposed to entropy, a measure used originally and still largely in physics for an increase in randomness in physical systems. Yet extropians use it as if it applied only to human affairs, ignoring its actual and original meaning. Complain complain.... -- Harry S. Hawk habs@extropy.org Electronic Communications Officer, Extropy Institute Inc. The Extropians Mailing List, Since 1991 EXTROPY -- A measure of intelligence, information, energy, vitality, experience, diversity, opportunity, and growth. EXTROPIANISM -- The philosophy that seeks to increase extropy. & h 4 habs@panix.com Tue Jul 27 06:42 39/1285 Extropy Org 11 whitaker@eternity.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 27 16:14 48/1821 Re: new domain please: ec > 16 habs@panix.com Tue Jul 27 18:53 54/2008 Extropy Definition (fwd) N 17 habs@gnu.ai.mit.edu Tue Jul 27 20:03 41/1314 Re: Extropy question. N 18 jamie@netcom.com Tue Jul 27 22:50 29/1057 interview N 19 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 02:34 851/40051 Extropians Digest N 20 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 08:43 975/47292 Extropians Digest N 21 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 08:44 1068/49951 Extropians Digest N 22 desilets@sj.ate.slb.com Wed Jul 28 09:38 45/1538 RESCHEDULED !!! Extropian N 23 dkrieger@Synopsys.COM Wed Jul 28 11:19 31/1481 Naomi Reynolds N 24 dkrieger@Synopsys.COM Wed Jul 28 11:52 44/1863 Information on ExI needed N 25 salsbury@netcom.com Wed Jul 28 11:54 164/7602 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] N 26 habs@panix.com Wed Jul 28 12:27 177/8289 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] N 27 betsys@cs.umb.edu Wed Jul 28 12:46 23/874 distribution of Extropian N 28 iguana@Athena.MIT.EDU Wed Jul 28 14:34 16/674 N 29 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 15:00 916/43591 Extropians Digest N 30 wt@ptolemy.arc.nasa.gov Wed Jul 28 20:58 32/1465 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] N 31 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 21:19 1022/43530 Extropians Digest N 32 Exi@panix.com Thu Jul 29 04:21 917/44638 Extropians Digest N 33 cherrie@clbooks.com Thu Jul 29 10:00 120/4289 CLB EVENT NOTICE & d16 & 17 Message 17: From habs@gnu.ai.mit.edu Tue Jul 27 20:03:08 1993 Return-Path: Received: from usc.edu by chaph.usc.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1+ucs-3.0) id AA19692; Tue, 27 Jul 93 20:03:08 PDT Received: from geech.gnu.ai.mit.edu by usc.edu (4.1/SMI-3.0DEV3-USC+3.1) id AA02272; Tue, 27 Jul 93 20:03:06 PDT Received: by geech.gnu.ai.mit.edu (5.65/4.0) id ; Tue, 27 Jul 93 23:02:51 -0400 From: habs@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Harry A B Shapiro) Message-Id: <9307280302.AA21232@geech.gnu.ai.mit.edu> Subject: Re: Extropy question. To: allan@elvis.tamu.edu (Allan Bailey) Date: Tue, 27 Jul 93 23:02:49 WET DST Cc: more@usc.edu In-Reply-To: <9307262015.AA22022@elvis.tamu.edu>; from "Allan Bailey" at Jul 26, 93 3:15 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Status: R Youshould talk to Max. /hawk A conscious being, Allan Bailey wrote: > > > I sent $30.00 to the Extropy address published in the Mailing Lists > list posted to UseNet for subscription and joining the Extropian Institute. > > Is there some criteria/prerequisites for joining? Or will my money > be refunded/returned? > > Or, should I instead send this query to Max Moore? > > -- > Allan Bailey, UNIX programmer, CSC | "Freedom is not free." > Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations | or: allan.bailey@tamu.edu > > -- & USC-UCC-D Instanet6600 Data PABX channel D:05/033 Which system? aludra You are connected to channel D:10/028 from channel D:05/033. USC Student Computing Facility -- SunOS Unix (aludra.usc.edu) (ttyjb) login: more Password: Last login: Tue Aug 10 07:47:13 on ttyhc SunOS Release 4.1.3-PL15 (UCSTS690) #2: Thu May 27 19:14:23 PDT 1993 System type is Sun SPARCsystem 600 with 384 MB of memory. Student Computing Facility (SCF) Time-Sharing System Sep 10: LISP jobs are not permitted on Aludra. Use Phakt. Sep 25: For help using this system contact UCS Consulting in SAL 125 or send email to "consult". For system problems send mail to "action". To express your views on improving computing services, send mail to "suggestions". The SCF time-sharing hosts are Aludra, Girtab, and Phakt. May 7: All computer account users are expected to read and abide by the UCS Computing and Usage Policies. Type the command 'help policies' to review them. You have mail. Block limit reached on /tmp_mnt/auto/mail-scf SCF Timesharing Hosts: Load Averages Hosts with low numbers have better performance and faster response. Numbers above 10 indicate a heavy load. To choose a different host, please logout then log in again. Your files are available on all the SCF hosts. Least loaded phakt: 0.18 aludra: 0.45 <-- You are currently logged in here. girtab: 0.70 aludra.usc.edu(1): cd Mail aludra.usc.edu(2): mail Mail version SMI 4.0 Thu Jul 23 13:52:20 PDT 1992 Type ? for help. "/usr/spool/mail/more": 81 messages 1 new 81 unread >N 81 pmetzger@lehman.com Tue Aug 10 07:48 48/1831 Re: addition to list (fwd & h >N 81 pmetzger@lehman.com Tue Aug 10 07:48 48/1831 Re: addition to list (fwd & h1 >U 1 jamie@netcom.com Tue Jul 27 22:50 30/1067 interview U 2 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 02:34 852/40061 Extropians Digest U 3 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 08:43 976/47302 Extropians Digest U 4 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 08:44 1069/49961 Extropians Digest U 5 desilets@sj.ate.slb.com Wed Jul 28 09:38 46/1548 RESCHEDULED !!! Extropian U 6 dkrieger@Synopsys.COM Wed Jul 28 11:19 32/1491 Naomi Reynolds U 7 dkrieger@Synopsys.COM Wed Jul 28 11:52 45/1873 Information on ExI needed U 8 salsbury@netcom.com Wed Jul 28 11:54 165/7612 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] U 9 habs@panix.com Wed Jul 28 12:27 178/8299 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] U 10 betsys@cs.umb.edu Wed Jul 28 12:46 24/884 distribution of Extropian U 11 iguana@Athena.MIT.EDU Wed Jul 28 14:34 17/684 U 12 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 15:00 917/43601 Extropians Digest U 13 wt@ptolemy.arc.nasa.gov Wed Jul 28 20:58 33/1475 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] U 14 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 21:19 1023/43540 Extropians Digest U 15 Exi@panix.com Thu Jul 29 04:21 918/44648 Extropians Digest U 16 cherrie@clbooks.com Thu Jul 29 10:00 121/4299 CLB EVENT NOTICE U 17 Exi@panix.com Thu Jul 29 16:15 1037/47612 Extropians Digest U 18 kqb@whscad1.att.com Thu Jul 29 16:46 452/19531 cryonics: #2362-#2364 U 19 Exi@panix.com Thu Jul 29 23:07 1000/41854 Extropians Digest U 20 habs@panix.com Fri Jul 30 08:28 43/1662 Info: Baclace, Paul (Look & 1 Message 1: From jamie@netcom.com Tue Jul 27 22:50:32 1993 Return-Path: Received: from usc.edu by chaph.usc.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1+ucs-3.0) id AA27002; Tue, 27 Jul 93 22:50:31 PDT Received: from netcom.netcom.com by usc.edu (4.1/SMI-3.0DEV3-USC+3.1) id AA07426; Tue, 27 Jul 93 22:50:29 PDT Received: from netcom2.netcom.com by netcom.netcom.com (5.65/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id AA03022; Tue, 27 Jul 93 22:51:13 -0700 Date: Tue, 27 Jul 93 22:51:13 -0700 Message-Id: <9307280551.AA03022@netcom.netcom.com> X-Mailer: Eudora To: more@usc.edu From: jamie@netcom.com (Jamie Dinkelacker) Subject: interview Status: RO Hi Max, Jacqui Dunne and I are producing a TV program and book (_The Diamond Age_) about nanotechnology. We'd like to interview you on your thoughts of the philosophical implications of nanotech. It is to be an "introductory" work, but not aimed to persuade people that nano is good, but instead to present a variety of perspectives on a range of topics about nano, its likely paths, timelines and impact. Your thoughts? Jamie@netcom.com 415-941-4782 & i if requires at least 1 arg(s) & h > 1 jamie@netcom.com Tue Jul 27 22:50 30/1067 interview U 2 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 02:34 852/40061 Extropians Digest U 3 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 08:43 976/47302 Extropians Digest U 4 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 08:44 1069/49961 Extropians Digest U 5 desilets@sj.ate.slb.com Wed Jul 28 09:38 46/1548 RESCHEDULED !!! Extropian U 6 dkrieger@Synopsys.COM Wed Jul 28 11:19 32/1491 Naomi Reynolds U 7 dkrieger@Synopsys.COM Wed Jul 28 11:52 45/1873 Information on ExI needed U 8 salsbury@netcom.com Wed Jul 28 11:54 165/7612 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] U 9 habs@panix.com Wed Jul 28 12:27 178/8299 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] U 10 betsys@cs.umb.edu Wed Jul 28 12:46 24/884 distribution of Extropian U 11 iguana@Athena.MIT.EDU Wed Jul 28 14:34 17/684 U 12 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 15:00 917/43601 Extropians Digest U 13 wt@ptolemy.arc.nasa.gov Wed Jul 28 20:58 33/1475 [asif@well.sf.ca.us: ] U 14 Exi@panix.com Wed Jul 28 21:19 1023/43540 Extropians Digest U 15 Exi@panix.com Thu Jul 29 04:21 918/44648 Extropians Digest U 16 cherrie@clbooks.com Thu Jul 29 10:00 121/4299 CLB EVENT NOTICE U 17 Exi@panix.com Thu Jul 29 16:15 1037/47612 Extropians Digest U 18 kqb@whscad1.att.com Thu Jul 29 16:46 452/19531 cryonics: #2362-#2364 U 19 Exi@panix.com Thu Jul 29 23:07 1000/41854 Extropians Digest U 20 habs@panix.com Fri Jul 30 08:28 43/1662 Info: Baclace, Paul (Look &