From: J. R. Molloy (jr@shasta.com)
Date: Sun Sep 12 1999 - 10:31:31 MDT
From: James Veverka <headbands@webtv.net>
<<No, it's not You are confusing a very small minority of loud mouthed
radical feminists with equity feminists that only seek simple outright
equality and respect.
The only men that complain are the mindless patriarchal social
conservatives that have an agenda of getting their flock riled up. It
is a black or white thing with these less than intelligent people.
The right wing fascist goons like Rush, the Christian
Reconstructionists, and their like stereotype women activists-feminists
into one group. They call themselves "libertarian"; that is ludicrous
and the typical deceptive logorrhea for the right. They are "Guns and
Gawd" people only. They would scrap the establishment clause in a
second if they could............jim>>
-------------------------------------
Let's try switching the objects of your invective:
"You are confusing a very small minority of loud mouthed radical right wing
fascist goons with equity libertarians that only seek outright equality and
respect, along with freedom and prosperity for all. The only females that
complain are the mindless matriarchal socialists that have an agenda of
getting their flock riled up. It is a black or white thing with these less
than intelligent people.
The radical feminist man-hating fascist goons like the N.O.W. (Non-Orgasmic
Womyn) and their like stereotype libertarians into one group. They call
themselves "feminists"; that is ludicrous and the typical deceptive
logorrhea for the left. The are "Stalinists in Skirts" people only. They
would castrate the entire male population in a second if they could."
Political rhetoric parses out a lot like tribal insults. "My tribe will kick
your tribe's butt" and "my tribe is better than your tribe" -- that makes up
the message.
For extropy to succeed with Homo sapiens socially, for networks of
cooperation and collaboration to supplant tribal warfare, I think we need to
understand that what makes people use diversity to create divisiveness, what
makes people group themselves into competing factions, comes from tribal
instincts, not from the supposed merits or faults of any particular social
or political program or set of principles.
People instinctively join (or create via families) tribal groups (political
parties, religious denominations, sports teams, and so on), because of the
strength they gain in numbers. Lone visionaries generally get beat up,
ignored, cast out, or vilified by mobs.
Not that lone visionaries don't sometimes deserve cruel treatment. Sometimes
visionaries take their revenge by starting their own group. I think
libertarianism appeals to extropians because it seeks to limit or reduce
government. I don't see feminism doing that. On the contrary, feminism seeks
to expand government and to control peoples lives even more. For example,
feminists in California and Washington enacted a law which requires husbands
to obtain permission from their wives before they can get a vasectomy. Not
very extropic, that. I don't think libertarians would enact such a law.
Libertarianism doesn't appeal to tribal instincts as successfully as
feminism does. This, I think, explains why feminism remains more popular and
powerful than libertarianism. To the degree Homo sapiens overcomes its
tribal instincts, I think it drops the whole business of politics. Without
tribal instincts, we'd have no need for libertarianism, and no patience with
feminism. Lone visionaries almost never go berserk. Tribes almost never
avoid going berserk.
Some extropians write about evolving beyond biology. They probably don't
think that by calling themselves extropians, and identifying themselves
tribally, they have already tied themselves to the biology of tribalism. I
think extropic memes will succeed among humans in proportion as they
transcend politics, religiosity, competition, and romance. Otherwise, they
will simply degenerate into just another brand of divisive rhetoric.
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