From: Joe E. Dees (joedees@bellsouth.net)
Date: Sat May 29 1999 - 18:18:43 MDT
From: Sayke@aol.com
Date sent: Sat, 29 May 1999 18:51:06 EDT
Subject: Re: capicity for violence = less violence? [was Re: Security]
To: extropians@extropy.com
Send reply to: extropians@extropy.com
> In a message dated 5/29/99 2:23:23 PM PST, joedees@bellsouth.net writes:
> > > In a message dated 5/28/99 2:05:02 PM PST, Josh.Clingenpeel@wwu.edu:
> > >
> > > > I'm actually curious as to where you get your information. If
> someone has
> > > > the ability to use violent force, they are going to be less violent?
> I
> > > > don't see how this is logical.
> > >
> > > hehe hmmm... so whaddya think of martial artists? are we more likely
> > > to be violent? how does that fit in to this? and whats the diff between
> an
> > > average martial artist and an average guy with a gun?
> > >
> > Hmmm...howzabout the ability to kill a dozen people at a hundred
> > yards in ten seconds (supposing black-beltish marksmanship
> > skills)?
>
> yup, theres a diff there; a matter of scale. but how many of these
> black-beltish marksmen do we have killing innocents? very very few. thats my
> point.
>
We've got a lot of kids shooting each other, and that takes no
training whatsoever, therefore there is no chance for discipline to be
instilled; that's my point.
>
> > > i think the main diff is education. many martial artists, like many
> > > legal gun owners, know what their doing, and how to do it, and what it
> does,
> > > and what the reprocussions of using their violence are. they are not
> > > ignorant about their ability for violence. ergo, they are more likely to
> be
> > > intellegent in their use of violence... and i think that makes all the
> > > difference.
> > >
> > If they're responsible, I have no problem with them keeping and
> > bearing, but if they have been legitimately identified as
> > irresponsible, they should have to relinquish.
>
> i have no problem with that, in theory... but shit. slopes are
> slippery, and making laws forcing the goons to relinquish their weapons
> requires, well, making laws, which means trusting politicians to understand
> the fine ethical line that i think is being treaded here... basicly, i agree
> with your goals but not your methods; i think ole crocker & lorray's approach
> would be, functionally, the lonterm lesser of two evils.
>
>
There is no other feasible method, and the only way to test mine is
in practice. It is strange to find such a Luddite mentality towards
experimentation, evolution, trial, error , refinement and repair on a
purportedly futuristic list allegedly concerned with the improvement
of the quality and circumstances of life.
>
> "i believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the
> people by gradual and silent enroachments of those in power than by violent
> and sudden usurpations." -- james madison
>
> sayke
>
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