From: cryofan@mylinuxisp.com
Date: Wed Nov 13 2002 - 13:37:41 MST
Rafal Smigrodzki <rms2g@virginia.edu> said:
> owner-extropians@extropy.org wrote:
> > On Tue, Nov 12, 2002 at 09:59:23AM -0500, Dehede011@aol.com wrote:
> >> In a message dated 11/12/2002 8:16:52 AM Central Standard Time,
> >> maxmcorp@worldonline.dk writes: Actually I believe that the most
> >> honest system is to have a minimum pension from government, as a
> >> baseline income. Then you can have your own private pension on top
> >> of that.
> >>
> >> Max,
> >> I would approach that idea with maximum trepidation. You
> >> will have let not the camel but the mooches and the power seekers in
> >> your tent. Ron h.
> >
> > Oh lord. This is why I don't call myself libertarian anymore. Max's
> > point was perfectly sensible. Rich societies these days try not to
> > let people starve, especially old people screwed by forces beyond
> > their control. So we can pretend everyone's responsible for
> > themselves, and enjoy the fun of moral hazards as people know they'll
> > be ultimately bailed out, or be upfront about the gov't providing a
> > safety net, and let people take their risks above that baseline. The
> > alternative is to actually let people die.
> >
> ### You can have your cake and eat it, too, if you give guaranteed survival
> but only those who prove they want it. Full-time work for 1500kcal/day
> assures no mooches come but then no sane people die, either.
>
> Vote for "The Poorhouse", a part of my plan to save the world!
>
> No need for a minimum pension, to survive you need food and shelter, not a
> cash handout.
>
> If there are people willing to die of hunger rather than work for food,
> well, I will not shed any tears after their passing.
>
There are all kinds of great plans to make our world a kinder place, but the
western countries cannot afford to do this for the third world. As long as
3rd world immigration is defacto unlimited, then all such plans are likely
doomed to failure.
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