From: Dossy (dossy@panoptic.com)
Date: Sat May 18 2002 - 19:54:47 MDT
On 2002.05.18, Eliezer S. Yudkowsky <sentience@pobox.com> wrote:
> Dossy wrote:
> >
> > Children and people in general must do the things they
> > are obligated to do because we're responsible for them.
> > Not because we're merely paid to do them. When my
> > daughter is old enough to take out the trash, I expect
> > her to do it because it's her duty and responsibility
> > as her part of the family, not because she's earning
> > an allowance.
>
> Woohoo! Someone has *totally forgotten* their childhood!
No, I remember it fairly vividly, which is why I'm going to
at least not repeat my parents mistakes but instead make my
own, new ones. ;-)
> Okay, try this one on for size: Some faraway adults you have no
> influence on decide, without consulting you, based on rules and logic
> into which you have no input, that you have a "responsibility" and
> "duty" to do something. This is called "getting no respect".
Sorry, you're right. You cannot assign responsibility, you can
only assign authority.
Of the list of household chores that need to get done, my daughter
will sign up for the tasks she wishes to be responsible for. We
will all share responsibility by taking an equal number of tasks.
I didn't mean that she would be assigned these tasks.
> It is why *you* now have a job instead of living with your parents.
No, it's because my mother is a demi-retarded lunatic and my father
is ultra-passive and if I continued living with them I would have
either killed them both in a angry bloody rage or otherwise gone
postal.
> You can argue with your children about the cash value of regular meals
> when they turn 13. Meanwhile, pay up, because having
> "responsibilities" over which you have no control, and for which you
> receive no compensation *that you control*, may easily put your kids
> off the concept of responsibility entirely. Responsibilities and
> duties are something that you choose for yourself. Not an imposition
> from outside.
<sarcasm>
You don't think the "you breathe because I allow you to breathe,
you live because I allow you to live, and you'll take the trash out
because I allow you to take the trash out" is going to work? ;-)
</sarcasm>
I do and will express to my daughter that there is a pool of
things that need to be done and as a family we all share in the
responsibility of getting them done. She will learn to earn her
keep and do her share of the work. Not because she gets money
to do it, because she won't. Because she loves us and is proud
of her family and this is part of being a family, sharing the
work.
> Your children are going to see morality differently than you do.
Thank god. I hope my child has more than I do, which isn't hard. ;-)
> Parenthood is [...] certainly an opportunity to learn important
> new self-control skills.
No kidding.
-- Dossy
--
Dossy Shiobara mail: dossy@panoptic.com
Panoptic Computer Network web: http://www.panoptic.com/
"He realized the fastest way to change is to laugh at your own
folly -- then you can let go and quickly move on." (p. 70)
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